....editting what u think about muslims... really important

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"Is that why the "good Muslims" are keeping quiet now? So why were they keeping quiet before 9-11? In 1993 they tried to blow up the WTC, in 1998 they bombed our embassies in Africa, in 2000 they bombed our ship off Yemen"

Those weren't the "good" Muslims. Okay so you hate all Muslims. I got that. Good luck to you. Just remember that hate is a double edged sword. It hurts the hater as much as those he hates.


Oh and before you go calling me "ignorant" again I suggest you check the forum rules not to mention my profile.
 
Charge_7 said:
"Is that why the "good Muslims" are keeping quiet now? So why were they keeping quiet before 9-11? In 1993 they tried to blow up the WTC, in 1998 they bombed our embassies in Africa, in 2000 they bombed our ship off Yemen"

Those weren't the "good" Muslims. Okay so you hate all Muslims. I got that. Good luck to you. Just remember that hate is a double edged sword. It hurts the hater as much as those he hates.


Oh and before you go calling me "ignorant" again I suggest you check the forum rules not to mention my profile.
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Can you point me to where I called you ignorant? I don't see that word anywhere - nor do I see anything that could be contrued in such a way

Unless questiong anything you say is considered calling you ignorant

Do the forum rules require that I agree with you - or :cen: when you make your case?


I also didn't start with the "scare quotes" - you referred to some folks as "good muslims" - I am trying to follow who you mean here

When you say "Those weren't the good muslims" do you follow what I am asking?

Obviously the bombers and such are not good muslims - but I was specifically asking why the good muslims were so quiet - read it again.
Where is the mass rally of "good muslims" against such acts?

We haven't seen it after 9-11 - which you think is related to anti-muslim attitudes - I think thats a bit of an odd idea since such a rally would only decrease such attitudes - but in any case - where was the vocal condemnation of the other terrorist acts before 9-11???

I am looking for the "good muslims" to become active in condemning such things - and I don't see it

I don't simply assume that most muslims condemn such things out of hand because I don't see the evidence
I can accept that most do dislike many such things - although many make exceptions when the targets are Israeli of any age or sex

No - I don't "hate all muslims" - you don't "got that" - unless your version of got that is just to put words in my mouth

( Let me try it - "Ok, you hate black people - I got that" of course you said nothing of the kind but then neither did I - wow - that is an effective way of winning an arguement ;) )

As for the pithy observation that "hate hurts the hater as much as those he hates" - what exactly does that mean?

Try this out - I hate pedophiles

Does that hurt me? Am I wrong to think that way?


I wonder why the only reaction you have to the idea of looking at Islam as an ideology as well as a religious faith and work to understand why terrorism and islam are so inter-related today is to just accuse me of bigotry

What would I find in your profile that would mean these things are not subject to discussion? Do you assume that your experience is greater than mine - that you know more than I do because _________ * fill in reason

If that is so I would be happy to learn - but you'll forgive me if I don't take your word for it :P
 
Your words:

"This "I can't blame them" stuff goes two ways. The continued silence by all the good Muslims earns them the unfortunate treatment you describe

I wish ignorant people wouldn't generalize in such ways - as much as I wish the good Muslims would take a stand"

Your use of "STFU" is _clearly_ a rule violation as well.

It was Whispering Death who used the term "good Muslims" or did you fail to see my quotation marks?

By "hate" I mean obsessiveness as one could think that you seem to be from your lengthly posts in this topic. Saying "hate" in the general form as in "I hate pedophiles" is something else entirely.

My pointing to my profile was not to indicate anything at all about you but rather to illustrate that I am hardly "ignorant".
 
Your words:

"This "I can't blame them" stuff goes two ways. The continued silence by all the good Muslims earns them the unfortunate treatment you describe

I wish ignorant people wouldn't generalize in such ways - as much as I wish the good Muslims would take a stand"

So where there do I say I hate muslims? I point out that the silence of this majority of muslims who we suppose do condemn such terrorist activities earns them such unfortunate treatement

Do I say I approve of such treatment - indeed not
Do I say they deserve it?

All I say is that the silence "earns" them such treatment
As our presence in Iraq today "earns" us constant attacks - doesn't mean we deserve them of course

I specifiically call it "unfortunate" treatment

My words that you re-post above make all of this clear


Your use of "STFU" is _clearly_ a rule violation as well.

I am asking if you are telling me to STFU - is that a violation?

It was Whispering Death who used the term "good Muslims" or did you fail to see my quotation marks?

My pointing to my profile was not to indicate anything at all about you but rather to illustrate that I am hardly "ignorant".

Where did I ever call you, or anyone else, ignorant?
 
RnderSafe said:
Tone it down, gentlemen.
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What he said!!


Use PMs if you have something to say from now on, no more off-topic posts wont be accepted in here!
 
Redleg said:
RnderSafe said:
Tone it down, gentlemen.
Click to expand...

What he said!!


Use PMs if you have something to say from now on, no more off-topic posts wont be accepted in here!
Click to expand...

Do you think this discussion is out of line?

Does it belong somewhere else and not in a topic about editing what one thinks about Muslims?

I really have no interest in offending any member at all - I am new around here - but it seems like even questioning some things is verboten around these parts - am I wrong about that?
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Do you think this discussion is out of line?
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Yes
Does it belong somewhere else and not in a topic about editing what one thinks about Muslims?
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Much of it did certainly not belong in here, and it was heading in a totaly wrong direction.

I really have no interest in offending any member at all - I am new around here - but it seems like even questioning some things is verboten around these parts - am I wrong about that?
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You are certainly allowed to question all things in here, but it all depends on how you do it...


Please use PMs, or start a new thread about this if any of you have any more questions.

Thanks.
 
Pogue Mahone said:
Redleg said:
RnderSafe said:
Tone it down, gentlemen.
Click to expand...

What he said!!


Use PMs if you have something to say from now on, no more off-topic posts wont be accepted in here!
Click to expand...

Do you think this discussion is out of line?

Does it belong somewhere else and not in a topic about editing what one thinks about Muslims?

I really have no interest in offending any member at all - I am new around here - but it seems like even questioning some things is verboten around these parts - am I wrong about that?
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You have a very simplistic view of the Muslim world.
 
Hi,

Btw : Happy ...........Eid al-Adha Everyone
Hug.gif





Peace
-=SF_13=-
 
Strongbow said:
You have a very simplistic view of the Muslim world.
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well, when you explain it that way :roll:

Its not a complicated question you know - I as asking what your view of Islam is, since I do question the required answer - ie:

Islam is about peace and the actions of OBL, Hamas, the Chechens, the Kashmiri seperatists, etc, etc, etc, are not at all representative of Islamic theology/ideology.

It seems that deviation from this mantra is cause for personal attacks ( "you are a bigot" "you are a simpleton" ) - attacks that require no type of facts to back them up


I am interested in the topic, not because I am "obsessed" or "hate" muslims - but because it is a reality of our times. We are engaged in a war at this very moment against islamist facists - men driven by islamlist ideology

Now you can say "they are not following true islam" - but what do you base this observtion upon - your own understanding of what religious faith means?

And if scholars such as Daniel Pipes are correct, and this Islamist ideology carries weight with at least 10% of the muslims in the world - we are talking about 100 MILLION people here.

This is not worthy of discussion?

Anyone who wants to discuss these issues has a "simplistic view" of the Muslim world?

You don't mind if I suggest that quite the opposite is true - that those who want to ignore these issues have the simplistic view of the world - muslim and otherwise.

I understand that there is an othordox view of these things being enforced by some members - an effort to silence any other view through simple attacks on others ( a tactic in widespread use in the muslim world I might note ) - I wonder if others all agree?

I was also told that this kind of discussion does not belong in this topic -

let me understand this - a discussion of these issues doesn't belong in a topic that began as an explanation of how it is important to "edit what we think about muslims"

I can't think of a better place for this debate frankly

Should we be editting what we think about muslims?

Should we also edit what we think about American's - to avoid any offensive generalizations? This would pretty much put an end to the European media :P
 
Whispering Death said:
All I'm saying is how the American public sees things. Sure you can argue me and make me say it is unfair, but regardless of whether it is just or not, it is the perception that deliniates whether someone wants to hug you or shoot you.

The perception is one of speculation because you NEVER see any prominent muslims going out and saying "These Al-Quaida killers must be delivered to American justice" but you do hear "don't racially profile, 24 is derogatory to muslims".

I tell you as history as my witness that if Muslims do not fall into step with their American breatheren then I am afriad I forsee some terrible injustices will befall them.
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since when did arrogance of a country fall into anything good? You can't damage 1000's of people for a terroist's fault. Muslim culture is bigger than america and they will stand fast, if they hadn't the gulf would of been over by now.

Going n blazing guns is not an answer. If so hang me for being catholic as my religion persecuted young girls for baring child out of wedlock, for torturing young girls for being attractive.So you going to blaze at Catholic's for making "magdeline homes"...............or killing 1000's of people in the roman times?

Because its the same
 
Anya1982 said:
since when did arrogance of a country fall into anything good? You can't damage 1000's of people for a terroist's fault. Muslim culture is bigger than america and they will stand fast, if they hadn't the gulf would of been over by now.

Going n blazing guns is not an answer. If so hang me for being catholic as my religion persecuted young girls for baring child out of wedlock, for torturing young girls for being attractive.So you going to blaze at Catholic's for making "magdeline homes"...............or killing 1000's of people in the roman times?

Because its the same
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But you do criticize those catholic practices of old I see

So why can't we criticize Islamic practices of today

It seems that were some of the folks here around in the year 1400 they might well be calling those who questioned those practices "religious bigots slandering an entire faith"

After all - these practices were official chuch policy - they were supported by the majority of christians at the time

Would I be right to call this understanding of christianity in 1400 "simplistic"?

Or would these folks be calling attention to serious defects in the teachings of the faith at the time

You need to start with some understanding of the scale of the problem within Islam as a political ideology

Islam makes no such distinction of separation of church and state as we in the West understand it in the 21st C

Applying our standards to Islam - placing it in a box called "religion" and therefor beyond critical review is one of the greatest flaws in our effort to deal with the danger than militant islam represents to all of us
 
What I'm noticing in the people like anya1982 who try to dispute what I'm saying is that they are telling me how things should be and I am telling you how things are.

Of course there shouldn't be any bad feelings towards muslims in America. But because the American muslims are not speaking out against these terrorist attacks, increasingly Americans are getting warry of just whose side they are on.

Remember, no human being should have ever gone alone with the holocaust but millions of germans who are no different from you or I did do it.
 
Whispering Death said:
What I'm noticing in the people like anya1982 who try to dispute what I'm saying is that they are telling me how things should be and I am telling you how things are.

Of course there shouldn't be any bad feelings towards muslims in America. But because the American muslims are not speaking out against these terrorist attacks, increasingly Americans are getting warry of just whose side they are on.

Remember, no human being should have ever gone alone with the holocaust but millions of germans who are no different from you or I did do it.
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Arrogance again.

1) I ain't saying what should be.

2) i am not slamming on old practises, iw as just saying if your gonna tortue every islam.muslim for 9/11 then why not torture catholics as they were worse in hsitory.Mod edit: another derisive bigotted comment this time it's anti-catholic, for shame.

3) Mod Edit: Ratchet it down .

4) What you lot are talking about is a plain salem witch hunt
 
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