How do we deal with Pirate attacks?

the_13th_redneck said:
Get sprayed by tear gas for fifteen minutes, then we'll talk.
Your ass will jump right off the deck and into the water.
Is the option of the armed guards better? Yes, I think so. But the issues I was tackling were:
1) Sailors don't want to really fight back.
2) Security teams cost a lot of money and you have to keep paying them.
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As I mentioned before, a buddy of my son is an engineering cadet officer for SAFF Marine (South Africa's merchant navy) he and he buddies want the right to protection including fighting back with lethal force.

Yes security teams do cost money, but the hike in insurance rates costs more money. I remember a recent TV programme that highlighted the problems of piracy and the resulting rise in insurance rates, if I remember correctly it was something like 5% of the cargo value, over and above the normal insurance rates.

Companies who operate LNG (Liquid Natural Gas) tankers are concerned with putting armed teams on board. As I have never worked with these tankers, I have no idea as to the volatility of such a cargo.

Remember its the consumer who pays at the end, the likes of you and I.
 
Just saying there could be alternatives for those who have crew that do not wish to fight back.
Either way, I think the capability of being able to tear gas the deck could come in handy.
 
the_13th_redneck said:
Get sprayed by tear gas for fifteen minutes, then we'll talk.
Your ass will jump right off the deck and into the water.
Is the option of the armed guards better? Yes, I think so. But the issues I was tackling were:
1) Sailors don't want to really fight back.
2) Security teams cost a lot of money and you have to keep paying them.
Click to expand...

(1)Man was born to fight against who infringe upon him
(2)Sailors are Secuirity while Secuirity are Sailors . You do not nedd to pay more.
 
Go back to what people said earlier on this topic and you'll know those two conditions were raised by others not myself. I've just come up with something that would solve those two issues.
Personally I've said that even a minimal security crew would do the job and even came up with suggestions as how to make sure the weapons the security team uses don't become an issue.
PLUS. No, not everyone wants to fight back against pirates. Why? Because they know the pirates want them alive, not dead and that their company will pay the ransom and they will be free. It's almost routine. I knew a guy who was held captive in Colombia (because he is from Colombia) and he told me that being held for ransom there isn't very uncommon at all and he wasn't treated badly during captivity. It's a pretty consistent pattern, even with Somalia.
So why don't you actually learn about the issue at hand than spray some generic BS like "man was born to fight against those who infringe upon him" and "sailors are security while security are sailors." You are so full of sh*t.
 
the_13th_redneck said:
Go back to what people said earlier on this topic and you'll know those two conditions were raised by others not myself. I've just come up with something that would solve those two issues.
Personally I've said that even a minimal security crew would do the job and even came up with suggestions as how to make sure the weapons the security team uses don't become an issue.
PLUS. No, not everyone wants to fight back against pirates. Why? Because they know the pirates want them alive, not dead and that their company will pay the ransom and they will be free. It's almost routine. I knew a guy who was held captive in Colombia (because he is from Colombia) and he told me that being held for ransom there isn't very uncommon at all and he wasn't treated badly during captivity. It's a pretty consistent pattern, even with Somalia.
So why don't you actually learn about the issue at hand than spray some generic BS like "man was born to fight against those who infringe upon him" and "sailors are security while security are sailors." You are so full of sh*t.
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You just do not know what if we arm sailors. Just like the situation over 1970s~1980s in China. They have armed sailors and all commercial ships are authorized to fight againt anyone looks like pirate and attempt to get close to them. So, pirate dare not to tuch Chinese ship at that period.

My suggestion can work well, and what about yours?
 
OMFG, did you even read what I wrote?
Having even a minimal security team would deter the vast majority of attacks.
That is would be my number 1 option.

You realize that with those Chinese ships with armed sailors they had a lot of incidents of murders and drunken fits of violence that turned sour right? Do you think that sort of stuff would ever fly on a US ship? Heck no.
Also, in terms of the legal stuff, they have a lot more leeway than we do. That's just the unfortunate fact. That's not going to change so we have to work with it.
 
"Having even a minimal security team would deter the vast majority of attacks. That is would be my number 1 option."

Yup ... and compared to all the other costs involved they would be cheap ... especially if the crews were rotated from ship to ship only in the most dangerous waters (Gulf of Aden).

Tear gas would be interesting to try ... but I wonder how fast the pirates would get masks? At first they would probably retreat then move on to 'softer' targets. If it became a common practice, I figure they'd adapt.
 
The odds of them getting proper gas masks that work probably aren't very good at all.
Firearms are one thing, but gas masks are far less common.
It's just an idea I threw out there. Nonlethal response for companies that aren't crazy about killing pirates.
 
To develop n the Gassing plan..

Gas them of their targetship, call in the Navy to cancel the contract on either the pirates and/or their vessel.
Teargas dissapates fast in maritime inviroments, but to get a few illtrained pirates off your ship it should do the trick.
 
KJ said:
Teargas dissapates fast in maritime inviroments, but to get a few illtrained pirates off your ship it should do the trick.
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And that's the idea.
I realize that the gas will be blown around quite a bit, which is why I said there should be a lot of it pumped out onto the deck.
 
How about automating the ships?

With the technical sophistication of most vessels these days I imagine the technology to transmit information about the trip and transmit back input wouldn't be too terribly difficult.

Pirate's could still hold the cargo ransom but they'd be 100x easier to handle without meat shields.
 
I have a way to drive the pirates to suicide :) let then watch CNN continually hearing about MJ dyeing :)
Trust me after about 3 days, they'll blow their brains out just to get the news to stop.
 
wolfen said:
I have a way to drive the pirates to suicide :) let then watch CNN continually hearing about MJ dyeing :)
Trust me after about 3 days, they'll blow their brains out just to get the news to stop.
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heheheh... too bad that'll constitute as torture!
 
A mariner's two cents

I'm sure it's a tough pill to swallow, but the only permanent solution to the Somalian piracy problem is stability. I agree with UnitedSomalia for the most part. The United States should either pick a side and follow through, or stop meddling altogether. I believe the Islamic Courts Union stood the best chance of exerting effective control over the country, and perhaps still can as an element within the TFG. So what if they're Muslims? Saudi Arabia is one of the most repressive, evil governments in the world, and we're pretty buddy-buddy with them, aren't we?

Simply put, there is hope for a stable Somalia! After all, for a country with no effective government, they have a hell of a lot of airlines. As for Somaliland, they already have a functioning country with a stable government and economy. We'll have to wait and see what happens with them.

Now, people are tired of thinking about Somalia; that's understandable. People remember UNITAF and Blackhawk Down bitterly. But, if I may be bold, the militia in Mogadishu correctly identified our country as the enemy and successfully evicted us. That is not an indictment of the servicemen who went there, but people fail to realize that we had already caused great suffering by supporting their oppressor, Siad Barre. Just because Barre was deposed did not return us to pristine innocence. It is wrong to say that we have been friends of the Somalian people.

However, what's in the past is in the past. We can't change the past. There are still quite a few things we can do.

We can pressure Somalia's neighbors to leave them alone. Invasions strengthen the separatists and extremists.

We can join with other nations in combating piracy in a united front. Patrolling narrow shipping lanes and working with the IMO to allow ships to carry armed security (I do NOT want to arm the crew) are just two ways we can reduce piracy and subsequently stem the flow of money to violent groups in Somalia.

When there is a reasonable expectation of getting a return on investment, we should invest in infrastructure projects to allow Somalia to become a more modern country. Police, ports, railroads, and telephony all need drastic improvement. This can work!

Sorry if this post kind of bounces around. It's 0420 and I'm dog-tired.
 
You do realize what happens to all aid money that goes there right? It goes into the warlord's new palace and his children's education fees at the Swiss private high schools.
And guns, better outboard motors...
No, sticking to a side is a bad idea. Usually in these piss fights one side is no better than the other.
And stop saying "us." You're obviously one of them.
And you're not being "bold," you're being an idiot.
People were starving to death on live TV and something had to be done about it. Unfortunately the public did not have the stomach to see the mission through.
 
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It probably wouldn't matter who controls Somalia as long as they didn't support Al-Quida, & would stop the piracy. From news reports most of the boardings are by ropes. On ships with decent hull height they might try greasing the hull up real good, probably too easy an answer.
 
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