World Cup

[Sevens]

So TI.....are you by any chance excited that France lost? I'm just curious. I'm getting some mixed vibes here.

 

[A Can of Man]

haha France...
South Korea vs Nigeria might have been one of the matches of the tournament. During the 90 minutes that ensued, Greece, Nigeria and South Korea took turns at 2nd place in their group behind Argentina depending on the goals. I don't know if any group has had it that crazy in this World Cup so far.
The US REALLY should be at 1W 1D 0L at this point but the referee ruled out the winning goal for the US against Slovenia for unknown reasons. Hopefully the USMNT can pull off a win against Algeria... with a draw it'll depend on England vs Slovenia.
USA USA USA USA USA

 

[perseus]

Interesting rules by the way.

England and the US need a win to go through for certain.

If England and the US both draw then the teams will be equal on points and goal average. However, USA will go through on the basis of scoring more goals unless England draw by 3 or more goals than the US.

If England draw by 2 more goals than the US, the US and England pick lots since both teams will be equal on every measure (not joking)

note d) to g) are irrelevant here since they drew 1-1. c) is the killer!

The ranking of each team in each group will be determined as follows:
a) greatest number of points obtained in all group matches;
b) goal difference in all group matches;
c) greatest number of goals scored in all group matches.
If two or more teams are equal on the basis of the above three criteria, their rankings will be determined as follows:
d) greatest number of points obtained in the group matches between the teams concerned;
e) goal difference resulting from the group matches between the teams concerned;
f) greater number of goals scored in all group matches between the teams concerned;
g) drawing of lots by the FIFA Organising Committee.

http://fredericiana.com/2010/06/16/fifa-world-cup-tie-breaker-rules/

Table Here

http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/standings/index.html

 

[perseus]

1-0. So far so good, but not counting chickens. I understand the French team were flying back economy class. Perhaps if England don't win we should make them walk.

 

[perseus]

Gosh that was nailbiting, England and US both win and go through. England played much better than last time and were dominant but Slovenia still had several chances at levelling it. US win the group due to the number of goals rule. They will play the runners up of this mob and England the winners.

GHA-GER

AUS-SRB

Not much to choose between GHA, GER, and SRB on current form, but Germany have the Pedigree (sodding hell no penalties) so I guess we might be playing them. Both games start tonight 19:30 UK (BST) time.

 

[A Can of Man]

The US - Algeria match was one of the most intense matches of the World Cup.
Fully deserved for the USMNT. If they didn't go through, it would have been highway robbery. They had all sorts of referee calls go against them and their spirit and determination pulled them through eventually.
USA 1-0 Referees.

 

[Rob Henderson]

FIFA officials can kiss my red, white, and blue ASS! Even with the refs against us, we still managed to pull out the victory. We should've CONVINCINGLY won our group, but instead, it was "just the goal differential." First Edu was robbed, then Dempsey lost his goal! FIFA really needs to either reevaluate their officials performance or reevaluate the way they choose officials for the Cup.

 

[perseus]

I've constructed a freeze frame of the dissallowed goal here and placed a few markers to help.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/49723546@N05/4730199004/

You can measure the dimensions. ie distance between white line and foot or knee/divided by distance between white lines in each case.

Bear in mind the following offside rule

"any part of his head, body or feet is nearer to his opponents' goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent (the last opponent typically being the goalkeeper). The arms are not included in this definition. This is taken to mean that any part of the attacking player named in this decision has to be past the part of the second-last defender closest to his goal line (excluding the arms) and past the part of the ball closest to the defenders' goal line.

This might also be relevent, but not considered this since I suspect offside rules are additive not instead of.

Gaining an advantage by being in an offside position - Playing the ball after the ball has rebounded off the goal, the goalkeeper, or any opponent

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offside_(association_football)

I think we can agree after viewing this how difficult the officials job really are!

 

[perseus]

This type of video analysis would be even more useful in football than tennis in my opinion since in the latter case the game could be continued whilst a group of officials can assess the dispute, and the goal added or subtracted several minutes later.

 

[A Can of Man]

When in doubt, the decision should be in favor of the attacker.
But it seems that when it's the US playing, that law of football is being ignored on a regular basis.
Either way, the US had the character to fight to the end and eventually win that match. Unlike some overpaid, long haired European types who get their butts kicked by a harder working "weaker" side and then b1tch, moan and ask FIFA to change the rules.

 

[perseus]

When in doubt, the decision should be in favor of the attacker.

Like the 'hand of God' which threw England out if the quarter-finals in 86? and Ireland out of the finals this year. I'm not aware of this rule, it depends which side you are on I suppose, but unless we have videos to make fair objective assessments, we will all have to take refereeing decisions on the chin, like the random bounce of the ball and near misses which can turn a game either way.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0zjx4MAHzk

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/international/article6922540.ece

I'm not sure why you are against measures which prevent bad decisions since that is what you are complaining about.

 

[perseus]

The world champions Italy go out beaten by Slovakia. Quite hectic at the end with a flurry of goals and a rugby scrum in the back of the net at one point!

New Zealand go out without losing a match, hard luck Monty!

 

[MontyB]

The world champions Italy go out beaten by Slovakia. Quite hectic at the end with a flurry of goals and a rugby scrum in the back of the net at one point!

New Zealand go out without losing a match, hard luck Monty!

Hehe what do I care they were expected to show up and lose 3 matches, in the end they lost none against teams 40 places higher in the world rankings than they are.

They did far better than was expected especially for a nation with only 25 professional players to choose from.

 

[A Can of Man]

I'm not aware of this rule.

Read a referee manual. It's in there.
As for the hand of God thing, they should have been looking a little harder. Same deal with Henry.
Ultimately I think each team should be allowed 1 challenge each. A one time chance per game to challenge a referee's call. When the ball goes out of play, the referee could sprint to the sidelines, watch a replay from multiple angles and then make a final decision. Just one per team. Would add +2 minutes of stoppage at most.

New Zealand did remarkably well.
The Italians are rightfully out. They should have LOST to New Zealand. If you want to kick racism and cheating out of football, you can achieve it by barring Italy from taking part in your tournament.

Congratulations to Japan for destroying Denmark. Not a bad year for the Asian teams.

 

[Partisan]

I'm still gutted that I haven't been able to sit down and watch a match live, but I really do think that this World Cup is providing the drama and enetertainment expected from such a spectacle.

As always the S American teams enterain and wow us, whilst the European teams break us and make our eyes bleed, Asian teams surprise and African teams make us cheer, Antiopdean teams make us happy because they're there, sticking it to their former colonial masters.

All in all this World Cup is great, it has delivered on every level - except Englands performance, still I'm hoping for a cheque from Rooney for wasting my time watching replays, holding my breath now....

 

[perseus]

You could be right, but this is the US manual not FIFA

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2010/05/2010-Referee-Week-In-Review-Week-7.aspx

Perhaps you are getting confused with this FIFA rule

1990: The offside law is changed in favour of the attacker, who is now onside if level with the penultimate defender.

http://www.fifa.com/classicfootball/history/index.html

rather silly rule in my view, one is either ahead or behind never level, it depends how accurately you measure it! It should say 'favour the attacker if you can't tell' which would make more sense!

Either way the officials decision was right in this case, despite everyone thinking otherwise and taking views without analysing the evidence. Perhaps all the other decisions were wrong and against the US, but if so prove it and post the evidence like I have.

 

[A Can of Man]

Pointed you in the right direction didn't I?
Also, sometimes it's the lack of evidence that is the point. Like the goal that was supposed to be the winner against Slovenia. Just how was that a foul?

Or look at Japan vs Denmark. Yellow cards to Japanese players for hardly a thing at all and then a penalty for Denmark out of... even the Danish players were surprised. Oh and fouls against Denmark in the Japanese penalty box for fouls that seem invisible on multiple replays from different angles.

 

[Rob Henderson]

You could be right, but this is the US manual not FIFA

http://www.ussoccer.com/News/Referee-Programs/2010/05/2010-Referee-Week-In-Review-Week-7.aspx

Perhaps you are getting confused with this FIFA rule

1990: The offside law is changed in favour of the attacker, who is now onside if level with the penultimate defender.

http://www.fifa.com/classicfootball/history/index.html

rather silly rule in my view, one is either ahead or behind never level, it depends how accurately you measure it! It should say 'favour the attacker if you can't tell' which would make more sense!

Either way the officials decision was right in this case, despite everyone thinking otherwise and taking views without analysing the evidence. Perhaps all the other decisions were wrong and against the US, but if so prove it and post the evidence like I have.

Everyone including foreign (aka non-US biased) soccer analyst EXPERTS who I'm quite sure have more credence to their opinions than a man on a forum. Sorry, friend, but I'll take Steve McManaman's opinion over yours every time.

 

[A Can of Man]

I'll take Steven McManaman's karate kick over anyone else's as well hehe.

We've got a Spain vs Portugal round of 16 matchup!
Hopefully Spain will send Cristiano Fake Ronaldo home red faced and crying.

South Korea vs Uruguay
Uruguay probably going to win this one.

USA vs Ghana
If the US plays anything like the form they showed in the group stage, they're going to tear Ghana a new phonebook.

 

[Partisan]

Everyone including foreign (aka non-US biased) soccer analyst EXPERTS who I'm quite sure have more credence to their opinions than a man on a forum. Sorry, friend, but I'll take Steve McManaman's opinion over yours every time.

You should see if you could see some of McMannamans plays when he was on the pitch - dirty little b#str!. He knows what he's talking about, but isn't whiter than white.

Still I have to say that as usual the World Cup is delivering World Class entertainment.