What makes a Soldier a Soldier?

I have, regretfully, been absent for a majority of this thread. I just got back from a 4 week long tasking which took me out of access to the internet.

In my opinion a good soldier does what the hell he is told to do when the hell he is told to do it. Exercises initiative when the situation calls for it. Can endure weeks or months of being in the suck and still have the energy and willingness to continue the fight. Good soldiers need to have motivation...but not the phony super "I'm a baddass" motivation...but the pragmatic, dogged, and uncompromising motivation to always do what you're required to do. One doesn't have to like it...they just have to do it...

To the cadet that so graced this forum with his innumerable experiences about what it is to be a soldier...I would tread very carefully about the things you mentioned when you get to the regular forces. Only in the movies is one able to kill without remorse or consequence. 42RM seems to have set you straight, which is good, because had I seen it before him I would have likely been less forgiving of the garbage I was reading that you wrote.
 
I used to train army cadets when I first left the regular army. I had to listen to their BS on more than one occasion. They thought the cadet rank they held was the same as a regular soldier. They were informed quite implicitally that they were part of a youth organisation that was sponsored by the military and not actual military service. That said, it was quite satisfying to see the cadets who wanted to join the forces, sit and take it all in during lessons and apply themselves impeccably in all aspects of training.
 
There was time when the German soldiers used the excuse for the crimes committed THAT I WAS ONLY OBEYING ORDERS, they still got shot for it. Now in the Paras would be given orders for an attack but were always told if you spot an easier way of taking the objective then do it, but what ever happens you will take it. We were always allowed to think for our selfs and it was nicknamed Airborne Initiative.
 
LeEnfield said:
Now in the Paras would be given orders for an attack but were always told if you spot an easier way of taking the objective then do it, but what ever happens you will take it. We were always allowed to think for our selfs and it was nicknamed Airborne Initiative.
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yepper.......... in training a loooooooooooooong time ago one of the mantra's during said training was

MAKE A DECISION!!! Initiative was the key - those who lacked the ability never made it threw the course.
 
A real soldier hates war but is good it, to protect his mates, family and country. They are the ultimate pacifist because they fight for peace and security.
 
Gotta love prince Harry!

My take on this;
The army teaches unwavering obedience to officers, life so far tells me that seargents and corperals are where you really want to be getting direction from. If you are getting direct orders from an officer then you are probably already in the **** (especially if its navigation =)).

Respectfully I think thats why we have NCO's- to filter orders and take care of the mens wellbeing- a good soldier makes himself scarce when officers are around.

A good recruit picks a top corperal or seargent and models himself after that man. Thats how he becomes a soldier.
 
Rowan said:
A real soldier hates war but is good it, to protect his mates, family and country. They are the ultimate pacifist because they fight for peace and security.
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A real soldier does´t hate war and he does´t love it. A real soldier has an attraction for war and the art of war. Try asking some of the other veterans here.

headwards said:
Gotta love prince Harry!

My take on this;
The army teaches unwavering obedience to officers, life so far tells me that seargents and corperals are where you really want to be getting direction from. If you are getting direct orders from an officer then you are probably already in the **** (especially if its navigation =)).

Respectfully I think thats why we have NCO's- to filter orders and take care of the mens wellbeing- a good soldier makes himself scarce when officers are around.

A good recruit picks a top corperal or seargent and models himself after that man. Thats how he becomes a soldier.
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Unwavering obedience? I certainly hope not!

Sorry mate but it´s an awful lot of horse manure. Tell me, what´s your Platoon Commander's job? An NCO that filter orders would lose his stripes so damm fast that it would feel as if he had never worn them.

How long have you been a soldier?
 
Your welcome to your opinion 42 =)

You disagree the army wants unwavering obedience from its soldiers?

I came off my basic nearly two years ago, started becoming a soldier maybe a year ago, just got the tap from my PC to go and do my juniors.

My platoon commander? He takes his orders from up top, gives them on to his NCO's and then his NCO's make them work and give them to us. By filters I dont mean directly disobey or just make up their own version of whats going on.

I can appreciate your shock/ saying I'm all **** 42, but at the same time please remember we are from completely different armies, and while you are at the pointy edge of the spear I am a reservist.
My service consists of making sure I am as fit and prepared as I can be and pushing my peers to be the same, even though we all live in different cities and hardly see each other. 9-5 I work as a sales manager of a company selling kitchens, one of my Battalions PC's works in a bank, another works as a scientist. We come from every walk of life and once a month for a weekend or up to two weeks we get together and train, talk **** and hope we get selected for a deployment.

Our NCO's have served a far greater time then most officers and 90% of our seargents and higher have come from many years RF service, including many trips. That is where the backbone of our army comes from, In fact I believe the RF boys largely feel the same.

No disrespect meant to you sir. We are from different worlds and and perhaps that should be taken into account before you call me out.
 
I would argue that a Platoon is organized in the same way no matter which Western country we are talking about.
 
Maybe. But when I read your post it sounds as if the NCO's knows everything and the officers are imbecile fools. Or are you just sarcastic?
 
I didn't mean for a second that our officers are imbeciles or fools, simply that at my level the wealth of experience relevant to myself rests with the NCO's.

The initial post was intended in a lighthearted manner i.e when you see the lead scout start taking direct instruction from the PC you know you are geographically embarrassed or simply walking to kill time.

The part I meant was that to become a good soldier you must observe what your NCO's do and emulate it - of course a soldier is going to relate to his NCO's more then the PC.

Perhaps I made a judgement error in trying to make a joke like that in a public forum without taking into account other nations, ranks and their sense of humour - Sorry that was impolite of me.
 
Freyja said:
Maybe. But when I read your post it sounds as if the NCO's knows everything and the officers are imbecile fools. Or are you just sarcastic?
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Dear Freyja,

my daddy was an NCO (air traffic controller) in the Air Force, I was a 2nd Lt. in the Army. He retired 20 years ago...
Every time we discuss of military, guess what my old man has always been saying to me? "Shut up , you fool... it takes a platoon of lieutenants like you to make an air traffic controller like me" :thumb: :thumb: :D :peace:... experience counts, here!! :m1:

Sometimes, the NCO's are not so sarcastic... they really mean it!! (that's my experience, eh?)

A big ciao from Sardinia
Alex
 
Freyja said:
Maybe. But when I read your post it sounds as if the NCO's knows everything and the officers are imbecile fools. Or are you just sarcastic?
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Freyja........ 2nd Lt's are the *privates* of the officer corps....... and as such they have very limited knowledge.... a *good* Lieutenant will listen to the advise of his Platoon Sgt and senior NCO's... that is how *they* learn.
This is all done discreetly and NEVER overtly... meaning after said 2nd Lt. has made a *not-so-wise* decision, his Plt. Sgt., in private *suggest* the young officer *may* have erred, and suggest possible alternatives to said erroneous decision.

a 1st Lt is a wee bit smarter

and a Captain should now know the ropes and be a leader his NCO's will follow into hell if necessary.
 
Haha I agree with everything you hae said sheridan, But as an experienced officer and veteran I think Freyja knows this stuff all too well.
 
Depending on the reserve unit and situation. I can see the filtering of orders being a good idea. Reserve officers have extremely little experience and a receive a lower level of training
And end up with very experienced NCOs coming From the regular who have transfered to the reserves. From my limited observations some reserve officers are rank obsessed "I am the officer therefore my idea is superior" regardless of the fact SNCOs have BTDT in operations . They also have a tendency to micro manage where they try and do am NCOs job aswell as their own subsequently failing at both. Picture a poorly trained twenty something try inventing the wheel telling people how to do something job they were doing before he was born rather than doing his job and actually leading.

But I haven't met many and I am sure there many many good ones. The australian army reserves in some units are so while new world. .... thankfully you don't get this problem in the ARA. You still get some twits who assume because you chose to Be a soldier you are stupid. Even though you had been formally accepted to undergo officer training but turned it down. But I suppose it works for their benifet confidance in their abilities and decisions would be vital
 
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