View of Brits
The UK is investing heavily in defence, they now spend US$54 billion a year and have recently increased it again by US$4.5 billion to fight terrorism. By 2010 the UK will have the second best navy in the world. At the moment it is by far the largest navy in the EU, and the second-most powerful in the world. Its 2 new aircraft carriers look stunning and the Type 45 will even make the US destroyers look almost obsolete!! As for the Future Surface Combatant (New Triamran Frigate) it looks as though the US will buy the technology too! During the Cold War it was the Royal Navy who lost out to Margaret Thatchers huge increases in defense expenditure. But by 2010 the UK will certainly possess a formidable world navy.
The RAF is going to be amazing too. At the moment France have the biggest air force but the quality of the aircraft are no where near as good as the collaborative efforts between 4 countries such as the Eurofighter. The RAF will also benefit hugely from the F-35 JSF.
The British army are probably the toughest trained and most battle hardened soldiers in the world. The US troops tend to rely an technology too much. If the Army sort out some minor cracks in the equipment (like the SA 80 rifle) then they will only strengthen their current superiority in Europe.
As for Special Forces, the SAS and SBS speak for themselves!!!
Which European nation can compete with the UK in terms of worldwide forced projection? NO ONE!
With 6 new amphibious assualt ships and 2 supercarriers on the way, we will stretch our capability way beyond any other European nations capability.
The F35 will give us a stealthy fighter bomber, the likes of which France has no plans for. A fleet of Typhoons, F35's and Tornado GR4's will be part the most formmidable air force in Europe. We also have the Apache attack helicopter waiting to come into service as soon as training is complete. We used UAV's in Iraq, giving us valuable UAV experience. Successful use of the Storm Shadow cruise missile in the Gulf.
An extra £3billion, roughly $4.5billion to go into out armed forces budget in the wake of the Iraq war.
More experince gained from the war, the outstanding Navy of Europe, which is getting better and better all the time. An airforce which is about to claim the undisputed number one position in Europe.
Our fleet air arm will operate hundreds of aircraft, including the F35.
New AEW T45 Destroyers, actually the size of Cruisers, and new frigates that can fire cruise missiles coming into service in the next ten years.
We are the only global military players outside the US. Not even the likes of Russia or China can compete with us in a distant conflict.
The United Kingdoms global military policy means it can throw its weight around anywhere, making it more competetive and relevant than any European nation, namely France and Germany.
When the world has only one superpower, namely the US, it is the UK that has an opinion that actually counts in its eyes, with our defence abilities, which we will actually commit if we feel the need.
The RAF is going to be amazing too. At the moment France have the biggest air force but the quality of the aircraft are no where near as good as the collaborative efforts between 4 countries such as the Eurofighter. The RAF will also benefit hugely from the F-35 JSF.
The British army are probably the toughest trained and most battle hardened soldiers in the world. The US troops tend to rely an technology too much. If the Army sort out some minor cracks in the equipment (like the SA 80 rifle) then they will only strengthen their current superiority in Europe.
As for Special Forces, the SAS and SBS speak for themselves!!!
Which European nation can compete with the UK in terms of worldwide forced projection? NO ONE!
With 6 new amphibious assualt ships and 2 supercarriers on the way, we will stretch our capability way beyond any other European nations capability.
The F35 will give us a stealthy fighter bomber, the likes of which France has no plans for. A fleet of Typhoons, F35's and Tornado GR4's will be part the most formmidable air force in Europe. We also have the Apache attack helicopter waiting to come into service as soon as training is complete. We used UAV's in Iraq, giving us valuable UAV experience. Successful use of the Storm Shadow cruise missile in the Gulf.
An extra £3billion, roughly $4.5billion to go into out armed forces budget in the wake of the Iraq war.
More experince gained from the war, the outstanding Navy of Europe, which is getting better and better all the time. An airforce which is about to claim the undisputed number one position in Europe.
Our fleet air arm will operate hundreds of aircraft, including the F35.
New AEW T45 Destroyers, actually the size of Cruisers, and new frigates that can fire cruise missiles coming into service in the next ten years.
We are the only global military players outside the US. Not even the likes of Russia or China can compete with us in a distant conflict.
The United Kingdoms global military policy means it can throw its weight around anywhere, making it more competetive and relevant than any European nation, namely France and Germany.
When the world has only one superpower, namely the US, it is the UK that has an opinion that actually counts in its eyes, with our defence abilities, which we will actually commit if we feel the need.
Mark Conley
Active member
This has got to be the most literate and comprehensive of all the descriptions I have seen dealing with the abilitys and future expansion of the British armed Forces.
This is why there will always be an England..there are still stanch defenders of their isle and hearth left in thier country. This makes me feel very grateful to see, not like the actions of all those hairy toothed teenagers that used to give me and my own a ration of cr*p every time we left the base.
Stand tall there blackjack.
This is why there will always be an England..there are still stanch defenders of their isle and hearth left in thier country. This makes me feel very grateful to see, not like the actions of all those hairy toothed teenagers that used to give me and my own a ration of cr*p every time we left the base.
Stand tall there blackjack.
Doppleganger
Active member
BlackJack said:
It's not all sweetness and light. For one, we need to cut out the colossal waste and incredibly stupid mistakes the MOD make when either managing contracts to build our own equipment, or procuring it from overseas.
-The Nimrod fiasco.
-The fact that we bought Apache helicopters from the US that we cannot use until 2007 as pilot training is running 3 years late. That helicopter also has problems in firing its own primary weapon, the Hellfire, in case debris from the weapon damages the rotors.
-The SA-80 fiasco.
-The Eurofighter Typhoon fiasco. That airplane was designed to dogfight a threat that no longer exists. We knew this back in 1991 yet we continued to design and build something that is in many ways no longer valid. The F-22 Raptor is a superior and more advanced plane.
-The Bowman communications systems fiasco.
There are more but I think I'll stop there
The world is global these days. It doesn't really matter if we're better than the Germans or the French. In fact, we should be encouraging these nations to shoulder some of the burden rather than trying to win a race with them.
We have a good military and one to be proud of. But we have our mistakes and our bad soldiers too. We also seem to have a real problem with logistics atm. There's no point in having well trained troops if you can't supply them with the basics quickly enough.
I also doubt we could claim to be the most battle hardened troops in the world as that honour would prolly have to go to the IDF.
Refer to my post in the "worst issue weapon" thread.
America happily drpped two 500 pound bombs on Felluja, as well as unleashing C130 Spectre gun ships on the city. As a member of the British Army I can not begin to convay my resentment to this tactic.
We have experience in this field, and as the Spanish AND Americans are pulling out of Felluja, Briton was asked to plug the gap!
At the moment the Americans are sending out more "Tanks" (as the media says, probably just more armoured vehicles) to Iraq. What do they think they're doing?! They are losing the battle, so more fire power MUST be the answer!
Of course this will win them the war, just like Vietnam, Grenada, Somalia etc. Oh, and don't forget, they "saved our asses" in WWII by beating the Nazi's single handed.
Doppleganger
Active member
JEA said:
The Americans have a different way of doing some things and I'm not gonna go into the merits or lack thereof compared to what the British would do.
However, you would do well to remember that the Americans aided the Soviets hugely with the Lend-Lease program that literally allowed the Red Army to recover after 1941, not to mention the material they supplied to ourselves. It's gotta be pointed out that the US were not duty bound to get involved in the War in Europe in either World War but they did so recognising that the threat of Germany (especially in WW2) had to be stopped.
So while the Americans did not beat the Nazi's singlehandedly they did more to ensure that victory than any other country aside from the Soviet Union.
As far as the UK is concerned though they DID save our asses as by now we would be either speaking German or Russian.
Given that, would you rather they had just stayed on the North American continent and did nothing? :roll:
c/Commander
Active member
Frankly I don't think there's any non-Special Forces unit better than a unit of US Marines, but that's just my opinion.
I know the Royal Marines are supposed to be good, but I'm too young and havn't seen enough of their ops to be an objective judge.
US Air Force will kick everyone once the F-22 is delivered and fully operational. No question.
I know the Royal Marines are supposed to be good, but I'm too young and havn't seen enough of their ops to be an objective judge.
US Air Force will kick everyone once the F-22 is delivered and fully operational. No question.
c/Commander
Active member
Just did...sorry I left it a bit late. :rambo:
Well...let's see... :lol:
I worked with the Brits for a couple of years (Tank units, infantry, SAS)and I do like them...AND I AM NOT KIDDING! :rambo:
They do go to the point and get things done and I love their strong attachment to their traditions...
BUT:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
-it was funny back in the late '80 to chase them around during MOUTs...to return them all the lost mags from their newly issued SA80 :lol: (problem is fixed now!)
- they do have -and need- an impressive Navy...remember....they are on an island!!! :lol:
- they are global and really project forces...everywhere the US goes
- they need a strong army because they are so "liberal" that all the terrorist groups have offices and newspapers there and the Army will eventually have to fight them locally
-they are tough and hard trained guys and endure "ten different ways to cook potatoes" every morning at breakfast....fried, boiled, mashed, sauteed...I am sure that it is what is called abuse for their Iraqi inmates...
-SAS and SBS are outstanding....too bad they are Brit!
-they are globally more relevant than France or Germany because under the US nuclear and military umbrella...
But what do I know? I am French and we have been fighting the inhabitants of that Island since the beginning of times! :lol:
Can't live with them, can't live without, I guess!!! :cheers:
I worked with the Brits for a couple of years (Tank units, infantry, SAS)and I do like them...AND I AM NOT KIDDING! :rambo:
They do go to the point and get things done and I love their strong attachment to their traditions...
BUT:
:lol: :lol: :lol:
-it was funny back in the late '80 to chase them around during MOUTs...to return them all the lost mags from their newly issued SA80 :lol: (problem is fixed now!)
- they do have -and need- an impressive Navy...remember....they are on an island!!! :lol:
- they are global and really project forces...everywhere the US goes
- they need a strong army because they are so "liberal" that all the terrorist groups have offices and newspapers there and the Army will eventually have to fight them locally
-they are tough and hard trained guys and endure "ten different ways to cook potatoes" every morning at breakfast....fried, boiled, mashed, sauteed...I am sure that it is what is called abuse for their Iraqi inmates...
-SAS and SBS are outstanding....too bad they are Brit!
-they are globally more relevant than France or Germany because under the US nuclear and military umbrella...
But what do I know? I am French and we have been fighting the inhabitants of that Island since the beginning of times! :lol:
Can't live with them, can't live without, I guess!!! :cheers:
Sorry I haven't been posting for a while, but have't been able to due to work.
I agree that the French, German and Brit's haven't seen eye to eye lately, but if it wasn't for Tony Blair being such a pupet to America we would.
The whole "America winning WWII for us" is bollocks. Remember their industry was not decimated by the Luftwaffe (as they were providing arms for the rest of the world, this in-fact boosted their industries), and they only got involved for their own interest (pearl harbour). Whoes to say if America didn't join the war we wouldn't have won, but we the Brits, would not all be speaking German now regardless!!! (the "what language would we be speaking" arguement really pisses me off, what language do American's speak after all?!)
You talk about how professional American soldies are, erm, what about the abuse of Iraqi prisoners. Someone truely dedicated to their job would not have let this happen. According to Pte England "everyone knew about it [, the abuse], from the company commander down". If you would like to talk about the British abuse pohoto's that have emerged, I wouild be happy to give my reasons for believing them to be fake.
I agree that the French, German and Brit's haven't seen eye to eye lately, but if it wasn't for Tony Blair being such a pupet to America we would.
The whole "America winning WWII for us" is bollocks. Remember their industry was not decimated by the Luftwaffe (as they were providing arms for the rest of the world, this in-fact boosted their industries), and they only got involved for their own interest (pearl harbour). Whoes to say if America didn't join the war we wouldn't have won, but we the Brits, would not all be speaking German now regardless!!! (the "what language would we be speaking" arguement really pisses me off, what language do American's speak after all?!)
The fact you don't see the problem with this only re-enforces my view! Bombing a city, with Spectre's or a 1000lber, WOULD hit civillians. They dropped it on a town. What's the blast radius for these things?! Can you honastly say that every building within the blast radius was hostile?!
I am attached to the REME, I'm not prepared to go in to further detail as "the powers that be" will dissagree with me posting on this site.
Why and how have you worked with all these units, I would (and have, once) considered myself lucky to work with the SAS, let alone a forigner having done so.
You talk about how professional American soldies are, erm, what about the abuse of Iraqi prisoners. Someone truely dedicated to their job would not have let this happen. According to Pte England "everyone knew about it [, the abuse], from the company commander down". If you would like to talk about the British abuse pohoto's that have emerged, I wouild be happy to give my reasons for believing them to be fake.
"Why and how have you worked with all these units, I would (and have, once) considered myself lucky to work with the SAS, let alone a forigner having done so."
More years than I care to remember all over Germany, Berlin included!
Exotic countries.
LRRP joint "games with SAS", even in their hometown...
"According to Pte England "everyone knew about it [, the abuse], from the company commander down". If you would like to talk about the British abuse pohoto's that have emerged, I wouild be happy to give my reasons for believing them to be fake."
Whatever....but I remember a specific British E&E were the bag over the head, the nakedness, uncomfortable position and nasty comments over anatomy parts by female participants was SOP!
More years than I care to remember all over Germany, Berlin included!
Exotic countries.
LRRP joint "games with SAS", even in their hometown...
"According to Pte England "everyone knew about it [, the abuse], from the company commander down". If you would like to talk about the British abuse pohoto's that have emerged, I wouild be happy to give my reasons for believing them to be fake."
Whatever....but I remember a specific British E&E were the bag over the head, the nakedness, uncomfortable position and nasty comments over anatomy parts by female participants was SOP!