Ninjas the old tactics vs modern terrorist threat

[A Can of Man]

I was referring more to their swift movement, use of silent weapons, excellent hand to hand combat and building infiltration skills.
Walking on water is more reminiscent of Kung Foo movies.

But it's no secret, a lot of Ninja techniques and tactics can still be used with great effect.

I love the way they walk on water, that tactic is smark, and can still be used.

 

[playstation60]

Ninjas

In my opinion, ninjas in the historically sense are outdated and no longer of as much use as during their time.

One of the main reasons a ninja was so effective is that they were trained basically from birth. No modern military can boast anything close to that.

I just don't see the point of having "ninjas" in the modern world. They are an old world solution for old world problems. Some of the techniques they designed and employed are used by our Special Forces teams right now, but that is where it should, and probably will stay.



Ben

 

[devilwasp]

I was referring more to their swift movement, use of silent weapons, excellent hand to hand combat and building infiltration skills.
Walking on water is more reminiscent of Kung Foo movies.

Yeah thier combat skills where great, the walking on water trick is an escape manovour, the ninja places stones in the water in places he wants and then if the need arises he can run at full speed over them while the enemy trudge through the water. The enemy couldnt use them because only the ninja knew where they where.
Have you seen thier weapons? The weapons they had where impressive.

 

[devilwasp]

Re: Ninjas

In my opinion, ninjas in the historically sense are outdated and no longer of as much use as during their time.

One of the main reasons a ninja was so effective is that they were trained basically from birth. No modern military can boast anything close to that.

I just don't see the point of having "ninjas" in the modern world. They are an old world solution for old world problems. Some of the techniques they designed and employed are used by our Special Forces teams right now, but that is where it should, and probably will stay.



Ben

The SF teams cant get into places a ninja can. Imagine you wanted to take out an enemy general in his comand centre, then a ninja would be able to do it and escape. A SF team would need to fight or call in an airstrike or artillery support to handle the problem.

 

[A Can of Man]

Imagine the psychological impact that would have had on their opponents!

Yeah thier combat skills where great, the walking on water trick is an escape manovour, the ninja places stones in the water in places he wants and then if the need arises he can run at full speed over them while the enemy trudge through the water. The enemy couldnt use them because only the ninja knew where they where.
Have you seen thier weapons? The weapons they had where impressive.

 

[devilwasp]

Imagine the psychological impact that would have had on their opponents!

Thats one of the cool things about it, another one is the way they could digest a sheet of paper and bring it back up and still be able to read it.

 

[Kinection]

I think you guys are overestimating a Ninja's capabilities.

Are Ninja's trained against interrogation techniques? What happens if the enemy has night vision? Can a Ninja trained in the old ways unerstand how to hide his heat signature? Can he shoot?

Under ideal situations, a ninja may do well. But under modern circumstances, no.

 

[devilwasp]

I think you guys are overestimating a Ninja's capabilities.

Ninjas where the old days SF goups

Are Ninja's trained against interrogation techniques?

Yes and infact many where trained to kill themselves if they where captured, the ninjas skill was not getting caught and haveing great escapes.

What happens if the enemy has night vision?

Night vision doesnt work through water does it?
The enemy can't be everywhere at all times.

Can a Ninja trained in the old ways unerstand how to hide his heat signature?

A modernday ninja could learn to by using heat proof suits, its just as easy to hide your heat signature as it is to camoflauge yourself.

Can he shoot?

Yes they had back in the old days very good archery skills and invented many weapons still used today.

Under ideal situations, a ninja may do well. But under modern circumstances, no.

Under modern circumstances and he being a top of the range ninja then hell yeah, i mean now he can snipe a target from miles away and no one would find him.
A modernday SF team has troubles due to security. The ninja wouldnt give his supplier away since his family and house would lose face, that was unacceptable.

 

[A Can of Man]

A ninja had no family. He had no name and his identity was considered the least important part of him.

 

[Kinection]

Yes and infact many where trained to kill themselves if they where captured, the ninjas skill was not getting caught and haveing great escapes.

Modern day soldiers are not told to seppuku themselves when interrogated. Soldiers go through a camp where they learn the proper techniques these days.

[quoet]Yes they had back in the old days very good archery skills and invented many weapons still used today. [/quote]
I'm talking about guns. Arrows aren't the best weapons for long range shooting, or for CQB.

i mean now he can snipe a target from miles away and no one would find him.

We have snipers that do that now, what's the difference?

A modernday SF team has troubles due to security.

What does this mean?

The ninja wouldnt give his supplier away since his family and house would lose face, that was unacceptable.

That doesn't apply to modern day situations, we wouldn't have "families." In this sense, it would be replaced by a country, but then again, all SF soldiers fight for their country and wouldn't want their country to lose face either.

 

[A Can of Man]

They killed themselves because everyone, if the enemy MUST and absolutely MUST have this information, will break.

 

[Kinection]

The military doesn't train the soldiers to withold all information, people that have information of that importance usually have been trained with ways to keep those secrets safe however. That may of course, include killing themselves.

Normal soldiers on the other hand are taught not to withold information but to live and endear torture and capture.

 

[devilwasp]

A ninja had no family. He had no name and his identity was considered the least important part of him.

He had a house he was from, even if the enemy didnt know it the buyer and house woudl know he betrayed them.

 

[devilwasp]

Modern day soldiers are not told to seppuku themselves when interrogated. Soldiers go through a camp where they learn the proper techniques these days.

Yes but this was a last ditch thing , like cyanide pills.

I'm talking about guns. Arrows aren't the best weapons for long range shooting, or for CQB.

Well this is talking about a person when guns didnt exist. If this was a modern day ninja then he would be trained in that and would probably be a marksman.

We have snipers that do that now, what's the difference?

Can a sniper mingle in with the crowd and have the abilitly to dissepear, they where great mercenaries.

What does this mean?

The larger the team, the more chance of the mission being given away by choice or by accident.

That doesn't apply to modern day situations, we wouldn't have "families." In this sense, it would be replaced by a country, but then again, all SF soldiers fight for their country and wouldn't want their country to lose face either.

Back then and still today loseing face in asia is valued more highly than in the western face. The ninja would rather die than lose face to his family or replaced by unit. These ninja's didnt really belong to a country in reality but to their families.

 

[devilwasp]

The military doesn't train the soldiers to withold all information, people that have information of that importance usually have been trained with ways to keep those secrets safe however. That may of course, include killing themselves.

Normal soldiers on the other hand are taught not to withold information but to live and endear torture and capture.

A ninja is not a normal soldier

 

[Kinection]

Yes but this was a last ditch thing , like cyanide pills.

Of course it's a llast ditch attempt. I'm comparing them to Ninjas and how they use suicide. I hope you are not infering that ninjas kill themselves when it's uneeded?

Well this is talking about a person when guns didnt exist. If this was a modern day ninja then he would be trained in that and would probably be a marksman.

Modern day special forces train hard, and they train long. They shoot A LOT to keep up their shooting abilities. That's a lot a Ninja has to do, especially since they would have to do more (train up their Ninja skills). The Ninja mentioned in the show was probably older than the SEAL team members. Military units don't tend to have too many old people. A Ninja master would have to train for many many years (*note* old) to get to a skill level equal to that of the ninja master from the discover channel. After training up on his ninja skills he would then need to go through jump school (imagine old guys doing HALO jumps), sniper school, and all the various things that special forces have to go through (possibly hell week?). I don't see this happening.

Can a sniper mingle in with the crowd and have the abilitly to dissepear, they where great mercenaries.

Camouflage = dissappear. As for blending in with the crowd, I believe that is what American snipers are doing all the time. Either Iraq or Afghanistan, Snipers don't present themselves as snipers outside on the streets.

The larger the team, the more chance of the mission being given away by choice or by accident.

Remember, there is a reason for a larger team. Some missions require it, you can't bring of synchronized attacks with one person. You can't get cover fire if you are alone.

Back then and still today loseing face in asia is valued more highly than in the western face. The ninja would rather die than lose face to his family or replaced by unit. These ninja's didnt really belong to a country in reality but to their families.

I'm Asian. I know all about losing face, but the family thing? Doesn't really apply to a modern day fighting situation. Soldiers fight for their country, defend their homeland? Are you saying that modern day ninjas will be trained to fight for and die for their families in order to not lose face?

Please note that i'm talking about Ninjas in a modern day situation and not ninjas from medieval japan.

A ninja is not a normal soldier

I know, i was just pointing out what a modern day normal soldier would do. Special Forces are different, and that is what we are comparing Ninjas to.



//Forgot about buddy's post.
Assassination jobs are reportedly not done by the United States anymore.

 

[ACTaFOOL82]

Ninja's are obsolete, its all about vikings. Well anyways, ya'll forgot Delta Force. Delta Force would own ninjas, in the end it comes down to this.

Delta Force (America's supersoldiers)=guns, anything else they need to get the job done.

Ninjas (Dont exist anymore)=sword, but they're quiet... oh wait so is Delta Force.

The Dreaded D is far superior to Ninjas, making this whole Ninja's against SF topic irrelevant. :cowb:

 

[A Can of Man]

Basically what is meant is Ninja tactics being suitable for the modern day. Not if we got some medival dude to come with his old weapons and have a crack at the War on Terror.

 

[ACTaFOOL82]

I would hate to be a viking in the war on terror. Most of the villages in Iraq, and Afghanistan have been pillaged, and burned already. :cowb:

 

[A Can of Man]

And if you do manage to find something, chances are it's a beheaded goat.