My collection WWII

[JT1959]

For something which is almost 70 years old and has been used on a uniform they look too be in too good a shape. It simply lacks patina, in my opinion.

The badge was usually lacquered with a composition called "Brennlack," which was a powdered metal. When oven heated the paint was burned, leaving a metallic type coating that will flake off with time.​

Der Alte:
Thank you for the introduction and info about the CCC awards :thumb:. Producers FLL and Juncker as you show pictures of, is the most common and many collectors prefer the awards made ​​by Juncker. However, I chose self manufacturer F & BL as the quality of these is generally much better and have cleaner nicer details.

However, I'm not totally agree with you on some statement:
Finding 70-year-old artefacts in mint quality is not unusual (remember that many of these awards have been in the original boxes since 1945!) In my coin collection, I have among other Roman coins from BC, in mint quality with exquisite touch brilliance (these are more than 2,000 years old).

If awards were used in the field, they naturally easily damage. Temperature changes also were exposed, was also encouraging rust and tarnish the process started. Improper storage at collectors will also impair the quality of several years of storage, so these factors can make the coating flake off over time. However, if the award is treated well and stored in proper temperature and environment....... Believe there will be awards of this type in mint quality also 500 years into the future.

Best regards
JT1959

I show here a few more examples from my collection of objects in top quality. Are these also fake on the same basis as the previous ones?

(mint quality = fake)

 

[JT1959]

How much did you pay for your Ritterkreuz des Eisernen Kreuzes ?
An original cost 6,000 to 8,000 euros.

I had to pay NOK 50.900,- for this one (same as Euro 6.500).

Regards
JT1959

 

[MontyB]

I would suggest getting a few of them authenticated that way you will know for sure rather than just accepting our point of view based off a couple of pictures, I would hate to see a genuine article destroyed off something I said.

But while I accept your point that they were in storage since 1945 I don't agree that they will be pristine because of that as I have my fathers and several uncles badges and medals from 1939-1946 and while the medals are pristine the badges have distinct signs of wear in contact areas (raised points, clasps etc.).

 

[JT1959]

I would hate to see a genuine article destroyed off something I said.

Thank you for your feedback Monty !
Do not worry Mate. I still have around 400 German objects left, so are not empty yet. Since you both have clear ideas about the awards, then I expect of course that you are sitting with the knowledge as well. If you do not have the knowledge, it would surely have been a mistake to judge them regard to originality?

However, I am no longer authorized to put up more pictures in this thread :-(
(must read a little on the forum pages to find a solution)
Sorry at the same time for possible strange sentences, as I do not speak English on a daily basis.

Regards
JT1959

 

[MontyB]

Thank you for your feedback Monty !
Do not worry Mate. I still have around 400 German objects left, so are not empty yet. Since you both have clear ideas about the awards, then I expect of course that you are sitting with the knowledge as well. If you do not have the knowledge, it would surely have been a mistake to judge them regard to originality?

However, I am no longer authorized to put up more pictures in this thread :-(
(must read a little on the forum pages to find a solution)
Sorry at the same time for possible strange sentences, as I do not speak English on a daily basis.

Regards
JT1959

Here is your best and fastest way of find out about the forums...

http://www.military-quotes.com/forum/questions-forum-suggestion-box-25/

post a question there and someone will help you out.



As far as the badges and medals go I would expect some wear on badges that people wear daily even if it is only in contact areas of the badge for example raised area will wear from cleaning but it is possible they were badges that were never issued in which case they would be in pristine condition.

I can only give you my opinion based on the pictures you have shown us so I would be wary of making too many decisions based soley on what I think.

 

[BritinBritain]

Before you destroy anything JT, please please please get them checked out.

 

[MontyB]

I agree completely.

 

[Der Alte]

Exactly!
Get it evaluated by an expert.

The very best reproductions were those made immediately after the war's end. These were made by the original manufacturers on their original dies, using original materials. These are virtually indistinguishable from wartime pieces. As materials ran out, and demand from souvenir hunting GI's increased, the manufacturers began using soft, lead based alloys and other inferior metals.

The most current reproductions are good. Very good in some cases. They can, and do fool experienced collectors as well as the novice. There is a far more frightening EK repro on the market today. It first appeared around February 2000, and is rumored to be made in Japan, on original wartime dies. These dies were supposedly purchased from an original wartime manufacturer that went out of business a few years ago. The obverse of this repro will scare you to death. It is amazingly accurate.

 

[BritinBritain]

Years ago in my shop, a German customer of mine came in and showed me an original SS ring, he said that he was going to the jeweller next door to have it cleaned. I was horrified, I told him that if it is original having the ring cleaned would devalue it considerably. I told him to get it checked out properly and ask advice before doing anything. Thankfully he heeded what I told him.

 

[JT1959]

Many wise recommendations here eventually :bravo:

Here a little wish from my side:
It could cause major economic losses to new members, if the board members commented that "I regret to say this, but I am quite sour that they are Reproduction" or "that they can not be original because the quality is too good." If new members receive this feedback, it may soon happen that objects are destroyed or sold as replicas at a fraction of the value.

I'm not saying this to scare members from commenting (Members Posts are appreciated and very welcome) You just have to be careful in terms of how one express himself.

Always recommended other members to consult experts, if you are in doubt yourself. :salute2:

Regards
JT1959

 

[I3BrigPvSk]

Thank you for your feedback Monty !
Do not worry Mate. I still have around 400 German objects left, so are not empty yet. Since you both have clear ideas about the awards, then I expect of course that you are sitting with the knowledge as well. If you do not have the knowledge, it would surely have been a mistake to judge them regard to originality?

However, I am no longer authorized to put up more pictures in this thread :-(
(must read a little on the forum pages to find a solution)
Sorry at the same time for possible strange sentences, as I do not speak English on a daily basis.

Regards
JT1959

Hi JT,

I have seen the suggestions to contact an expert. I know about one expert in Sweden. He has been on the Swedish version of BBC Antique Road Show. He works here

http://www.probusauktioner.se/

take care,

G

 

[MontyB]

Many wise recommendations here eventually :bravo:

Here a little wish from my side:
It could cause major economic losses to new members, if the board members commented that "I regret to say this, but I am quite sour that they are Reproduction" or "that they can not be original because the quality is too good." If new members receive this feedback, it may soon happen that objects are destroyed or sold as replicas at a fraction of the value.

I'm not saying this to scare members from commenting (Members Posts are appreciated and very welcome) You just have to be careful in terms of how one express himself.

Always recommended other members to consult experts, if you are in doubt yourself. :salute2:

Regards
JT1959

I would point out that no one is saying that they are reproductions because the quality is to good I am saying that there condition would raise suspicion that they may be reproductions.

 

[Der Alte]

Many wise recommendations here eventually :bravo:

Here a little wish from my side:
It could cause major economic losses to new members, if the board members commented that "I regret to say this, but I am quite sour that they are Reproduction" or "that they can not be original because the quality is too good." If new members receive this feedback, it may soon happen that objects are destroyed or sold as replicas at a fraction of the value.

I'm not saying this to scare members from commenting (Members Posts are appreciated and very welcome) You just have to be careful in terms of how one express himself.

Always recommended other members to consult experts, if you are in doubt yourself. :salute2:

Regards
JT1959

Sorry but this is nonsense.
No one forced you, it was a decision you took. I came with my own personal assessment, that was it. I'm no oracle.
It is not forbidden to think for yourself.

 

[JT1959]

Sorry but this is nonsense.
No one forced you, it was a decision you took. I came with my own personal assessment, that was it. I'm no oracle.
It is not forbidden to think for yourself.

:shock: Please.....
Why so aggressive?
I just came with a friendly suggestion to be careful how we express ourselves to members without knowledge.

Do you really think that is nonsense?
...and I really was not indicated that anyone has forced me to do anything.

I deeply regret that I apparently have hurt your feelings :sorry:it was not meant to be like that !

Take care
Regards from Norway
JT1959

 

[JT1959]

Hi JT,

I have seen the suggestions to contact an expert. I know about one expert in Sweden. He has been on the Swedish version of BBC Antique Road Show. He works here
http://www.probusauktioner.se/

take care,
G

Thank you for the link G :thumb:

When it comes to evaluation and taxation of my items from WWII, I use the expertise and experts on WAF (Wehrmacht Awards Forum.com) and GCA (German Combat Awards.com) for the German items. I close no purchase before both of these have considered and approved them as original. This is the only safe way to build up a collection today since there are large quantities of copies on the market. This routine has saved me so much money the last 2 years, and has resulted in a collection consisting only of original effects.
Membership and renomeet also means that it has not created any problems with return of the copy-items I have sent back to auction houses and dealers around the world :read:

I have since the spring of 2009 bought roughly a total of 400 German medals, awards, helmets, officer caps, uniforms, daggers, bayonets, etc from WWII. Same period I have also returned more than 50 objects, as they have proven to be copy / counterfeit or fantasy objects. In addition, I also refrained from many purchases as I have discovered the copies myself. Before I started my collection, I bought a lot of books / reference books, to learn as much as possible about how separate the copies from the original (good advice I will share with others who are thinking of starting a collection). Especially important is the knowledge and expertise when it comes to collecting on the top items in mint quality as I have done. These look, most often quite freshly made, and as others have mentioned, one is soon suspicious. It is then that knowledge is power!

Best to all of you !
Regards from Norway
JT1959

 

[I3BrigPvSk]

Thank you for the link G :thumb:

When it comes to evaluation and taxation of my items from WWII, I use the expertise and experts on WAF (Wehrmacht Awards Forum.com) and GCA (German Combat Awards.com) for the German items. I close no purchase before both of these have considered and approved them as original. This is the only safe way to build up a collection today since there are large quantities of copies on the market. This routine has saved me so much money the last 2 years, and has resulted in a collection consisting only of original effects.
Membership and renomeet also means that it has not created any problems with return of the copy-items I have sent back to auction houses and dealers around the world :read:

I have since the spring of 2009 bought roughly a total of 400 German medals, awards, helmets, officer caps, uniforms, daggers, bayonets, etc from WWII. Same period I have also returned more than 50 objects, as they have proven to be copy / counterfeit or fantasy objects. In addition, I also refrained from many purchases as I have discovered the copies myself. Before I started my collection, I bought a lot of books / reference books, to learn as much as possible about how separate the copies from the original (good advice I will share with others who are thinking of starting a collection). Especially important is the knowledge and expertise when it comes to collecting on the top items in mint quality as I have done. These look, most often quite freshly made, and as others have mentioned, one is soon suspicious. It is then that knowledge is power!

Best to all of you !
Regards from Norway
JT1959

You are welcome,

I am not a collector myself. I have a question to all of you in this field. How do you view the people who are out and digging for artifacts from the dual world wars? Some seem to be serious, others...

take care,

G

 

[42RM]

:shock: Please.....
Why so aggressive?
I just came with a friendly suggestion to be careful how we express ourselves to members without knowledge.

Do you really think that is nonsense?
...and I really was not indicated that anyone has forced me to do anything.

I deeply regret that I apparently have hurt your feelings :sorry:it was not meant to be like that !

Take care
Regards from Norway
JT1959

You could sound a little accusingly and when you don´t have English as your first language, it´s easy to misinterpret.

You must be prepared for the fact that most here have military background and that we say what we mean. We are harsh but honest. And if you don´t agree to something I said then tell me to go **** myself. In my world it's not an insult.

And also welcome to this forum. Impressive collection you have. Let's hear some more about the various medals and badges you have.

 

[JT1959]

Thanks for your feedback 42RM !

I now understand gradually that this is not a forum for collectors of militaria, so it's probably not that interesting with pictures from my collection (only old effects). I will post some pictures gradually, so we'll see the reaction. If they dont like it, then **** themself

Regards from Norway
JT1959

Here a few German Daggers:
Heer Dagger (Alcoso)
Kriegsmarine Dagger (Eickhorn)
Luftwaffe Dagger 2nd model (WKC Solingen)
SA Dagger (RZM-M7/42)
SS Dagger M33 (Böker Solingen)
Luftwaffe Dagger 2nd model (unmarked)

....and some WWII Medals from Norway

And they are all Originals items !

 

[MontyB]

Thanks for your feedback 42RM !

I now understand gradually that this is not a forum for collectors of militaria, so it's probably not that interesting with pictures from my collection (only old effects). I will post some pictures gradually, so we'll see the reaction. If they dont like it, then **** themself

Regards from Norway
JT1959

Here a few German Daggers:
Heer Dagger (Alcoso)
Kriegsmarine Dagger (Eickhorn)
Luftwaffe Dagger 2nd model (WKC Solingen)
SA Dagger (RZM-M7/42)
SS Dagger M33 (Böker Solingen)
Luftwaffe Dagger 2nd model (unmarked)

....and some WWII Medals from Norway

And they are all Originals items !

Well I dont know about others but I find them very interesting, when you live in a country that really does not have a military or architectual history stretching back thousands of years these images are very interesting.

 

[senojekips]

Perhaps I'm a little off Topic, but pertinent never the less.

What set up do you have for photographing the items in your collection? I really like your choice of what looks like a red baize background. I am not a Militaria collector but I am seriously interested in the digitisation of slides, negatives plus macro items and Documents.

This is my home brewed copy stand that I built out of two old enlargers and a backlit slide viewer. All lit with variable intensity cold LED lamps. Sorry about the quality but it was taken off a video clip.