FIFA World Cup anyone?

Ollie Garchy said:
A few words concerning the Italian football team & the lessons one can draw from their victories:

1. Violence as central defensive characteristic. Smash opponents in the face. Constantly mow them down whilst they run. Kick, lunge, and get in the way. Do NOT play the ball. A few yellow and red cards are acceptable. Utilize all body parts including the tongue.
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Ill give you that one, they, along with everyone else are becoming more violent.

Ollie Garchy said:
2. If in doubt, fall down. If it seems that opposing players are getting the upper hand, foul them or simply fall down. Many a game can even be won this way (vs. Australia, etc.). In any case, constant disruptions to game flow will ensure that you can break the opposing team's spirit. The "super experts" will even congratulate this type of behaviour.
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Everyone is taking dives. So did Germany.

Ollie Garchy said:
3. Taunt and pinch opposing players as often as possible. Opposing players seem to take great offense at being rubbed, tweaked, pinched, kicked, bitten, etc. Therefore, do it as often as possible. Some opponents will even crack. The great Zidane was only the icing on the cake.
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Yawn, everyone taunts. Seriously, watch replays of the World Cup and you will see that just like in all other sports, smack talk is part of the game. One is supposed to control oneself and not respond. Zidane just showed a lack of self control.

Ollie Garchy said:
4. If in doubt, mobilize the Italian press to help. Yes, Germany had the 12th man. But Italy had much more. They used their exceptional skills to manipulate officials, searched for ways to generate red cards off the field, and even mobilized domestic resources to pressure fifa and manufacture a victory.
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I wont say much because thats so stupid. What "skills" did Italy have? The power to manipulate the men who sucked at their officiating jobs anyway? Just because you lost, doesnt mean you have to resort to name calling to get under the Italians skin...They are just going to brush you off like a fly anyway.

Ollie Garchy said:
Italy a great side? Yes they are. They are so much more than just a football team. They KNOW how to win. Just look at how the Italian league operates. Their national team is just a reflection of this ethos.

Congratulations, Italy. I like your twisted way of playing football.
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Once again...SORE LOSER.
 
Yay, a 16 year old American teaching a 31 year old German about Football. :wink:




Anyway and Zidane's my hero too. Just look at the footage, Materazzi obviously said something very offensive. He just goes totally overboard and then stumbles away confused. I can totally sympathize with that.




BTW: I just read in the Spiegel Italy might be denied the title should the FIFA have evidence Materazzi said something racist.
 
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Sorry dudes,

1. I ain't defending Zidane.
2. I ain't a sore loser.
3. I ain't condemning Italy

What then,

1. The Italian team is astronomically more brutal, etc.
2. The Italian press encourages this violence...(Think about how Rooney is being treated in England for his red card against diver Ronaldo).
3. Italy beat Germany in an exciting and incredibly close game.
4. What about Frings and the Italian press...give me a break. What the hell was that? That was poor sportsmanship, not Ollie's comments.


Last point: I wanted to point out that Italy does not play football using (a) Brazilian-style talent, (b) Argentinian passing, or (c) English guts. I was commentling on the manner and style of Italian football that some in the press seem to have forgotten. Italy plays we-will-grind-you-to-a-pulp football. It works.

[By the way, I am glad Zidane was finally fully revealed. But ask yourself why certain Italian players are treated differently from Rooney or Zidane. Is a higher standard applied to non-Italian teams? That is: do we expect the blood to flow when Italy plays?]
 
Ollie Garchy said:
If there had been good solid playing, just a bit more fairness, good scoring, and some sense of humility, I would not have written these posts of condemnation. But all I saw was a dirty team playing crappy defensive football and then bragging all over the place.
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Not condemning eh? Hahaha. And loki, Im not teaching him, Im simply calling his falsehoods. Just because Italy won doesn't give him the right to say that they bribed or pushed their way into the winners circle. So those are the only 3 good teams who are worthy of listing? There are 32 teams in the World Cup. Just because they dont play with a)Brazilian talent, b)Argentinian passing, or c)English guts doesnt mean they arent good teams. Portugal isnt among that list, look how far they got. France isnt among that list, and they came in second in the WORLD. Italy plays agressively, and to tell the truth, it doesnt matter what anyone here thinks because we are not World Cup referees. Its all about judgement. It might look worse from the television point of view when it was really not all that bad on the ground. Then again, it might not look bad from the tele when in reality it was terrible.

If Italy expects blood, then they must have been extremely dissappointed with this year's Cup.


As to Zinedine Zidane, he got what he deserved. Smack talk is, once again, part of a game. If it was racist, well, Zidane should have been able to stay in. But would it have made that much of a difference? There were 10 minutes left in OT, then it was simply penalty kicks. Lets analyze the situation...Zidane is hot. He is tired. He has played over 90 minutes of hard football. Then he is fouled. His fuse is already short, and then Materazzi goes and eggs him on. Zidane snaps. Materazzi gets EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTS. Materazzi could have said "Sorry" in the wrong tone, and that could have been enough. Besides, how do we know Zidane didnt misinterpret what Materazzi said? They speak 2 different languages.
 
Ollie: What do you mean Zidane was finally revealed? And how come everybody seems to believe verbally insulting someone and his family is no big deal - but any form of "violent conduct" is worse than the Holocaust..?

Edit: Henderson I think Zidane understands Italian good enough since he played for Juve a couple of years.
 
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C/1Lt Henderson said:
Not condemning eh? Hahaha. And loki, Im not teaching him, Im simply calling his falsehoods. Just because Italy won doesn't give him the right to say that they bribed or pushed their way into the winners circle. So those are the only 3 good teams who are worthy of listing? There are 32 teams in the World Cup. Just because they dont play with a)Brazilian talent, b)Argentinian passing, or c)English guts doesnt mean they arent good teams. Portugal isnt among that list, look how far they got. France isnt among that list, and they came in second in the WORLD. Italy plays agressively, and to tell the truth, it doesnt matter what anyone here thinks because we are not World Cup referees. Its all about judgement. It might look worse from the television point of view when it was really not all that bad on the ground. Then again, it might not look bad from the tele when in reality it was terrible.

If Italy expects blood, then they must have been extremely dissappointed with this year's Cup.


As to Zinedine Zidane, he got what he deserved. Smack talk is, once again, part of a game. If it was racist, well, Zidane should have been able to stay in. But would it have made that much of a difference? There were 10 minutes left in OT, then it was simply penalty kicks. Lets analyze the situation...Zidane is hot. He is tired. He has played over 90 minutes of hard football. Then he is fouled. His fuse is already short, and then Materazzi goes and eggs him on. Zidane snaps. Materazzi gets EXACTLY WHAT HE WANTS. Materazzi could have said "Sorry" in the wrong tone, and that could have been enough. Besides, how do we know Zidane didnt misinterpret what Materazzi said? They speak 2 different languages.
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1) What about the Frings issue? Sort of doesn't fit, eh. Gotta love it when the opponents make a big stink that gets one of the best German players banned. Incidentally, the Argentinian involved denied that Frings hit him...a lie...but a noble lie.

2) When in the USA is a bruiser hockey or football team depicted as packed with talent? Some people love it and the teams can win, but nobody calls them talented or super-skilled.

3) When did I defend Zidane? The man is tough and is now going to have it even tougher. He has to pay for his sins. What about Materazzi...look at the clips I posted. The man is a barbarian. Rome fell to barbarians. It works.

4) When did I say only three teams are good? Everybody knows that Germany has the best team in football! Portugal...what a laugh. I love the way Germany's B-Team ripped them apart. All the diving in the world couldn't save that team.

[check out ihateronaldo.com]

Dude...this is just fun :)
 
Weird how noone commented on this other action (year 2000) where the peaceful Zidane broke the German player's face.

storico19059971007112036_big.jpg



And as for Zidane "walking away from Materazzi then hearing something and walking back to hit him", I suggest another interpretation: Zidane was simply nonchalantly checking the position of the referee before headbutting Materazzi. Once he saw ref wasn't around and looking, he quickly got back and hit the Italian.
 
So France caught your tounge? Interesting.


1...I agree with you. On the Frings issue. But Italy would have won with or without him.

2.Exactly. They dont have to be packed with "Brazilian talent, English guts, or Argentinian passing" to be considered good. Of course, the two sports you mentioned allow much more contact. The FIFA Laws of The Game allow contact.

3.You glorified his actions on the pitch. Same thing.

4. You listed them. Germany...3rd place. Nuff said. You can blame it on the officials and such all you want. But right now, Italy has the best team. Why? because they took care of every team except one, in which they made a stupid mistake. I have no doubt that had he been on that day, the US would have fallen to the azzurri as well. Portugal played solid football. Everyone is diving, so you cant use that. I love the way Portugal got further than Brazil. I love the way Portugal was stacked against overwhelming odds and still made it to 4th place.
 
C/1Lt Henderson said:
So France caught your tounge? Interesting.

1...I agree with you. On the Frings issue. But Italy would have won with or without him.

2.Exactly. They dont have to be packed with "Brazilian talent, English guts, or Argentinian passing" to be considered good. Of course, the two sports you mentioned allow much more contact. The FIFA Laws of The Game allow contact.

3.You glorified his actions on the pitch. Same thing.

4. You listed them. Germany...3rd place. Nuff said. You can blame it on the officials and such all you want. But right now, Italy has the best team. Why? because they took care of every team except one, in which they made a stupid mistake. I have no doubt that had he been on that day, the US would have fallen to the azzurri as well. Portugal played solid football. Everyone is diving, so you cant use that. I love the way Portugal got further than Brazil. I love the way Portugal was stacked against overwhelming odds and still made it to 4th place.
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1. We will never know. You sound like Italy (scoring in the last minute of overtime and then again with all Germans storming for a hail mary) totally overplayed Germany. That is the attitude that irks me. Italy's game against France was also not a given. France, while I did not like the team, outplayed Italy for most of the match. The Zidane affair killed their chances by demoralizing the entire squad. And, in any case, one penalty missing by two cm hardly indicates Italian superiority. No game was a given. All opponents had opportunities. Fortune smiled at times. At other times it did not.

2. Point finished.

3. I never glorified Zidane...never liked him or the French style.

4. I listed three examples. Should I have listed 32? As far as "everyone diving" is concerned...that is an easy thing to say. It is certainly not true, however. One team diving once or twice is not the same as another team diving 50 times in one game. This issue is about frequency. Italian players, by the way, dive all over the pitch and not just near the goal. Watch the games very carefully. You will see what I mean. They dive as much to disrupt play as to gain a concrete advantage. It is a tactic...and it is a horrible one in my book. If you like it, ok. Then this point is finished too.

Last point: Portugal was an insider's tip. They did make it to the EC final. They were a favourite and have been for years. No "overwhelming odds" here. I honestly picked Argentina or England as favourites. Why not Italy? I cannot stand their football style. Never will. I was hoping throughout that they would get wacked...Australia almost did it...but typical Italian cheating changed that outcome. COME ON, dude, do you really like a team that wins by bleeding the opponent or by diving. If you do, why not watch the Olympics...boxing, wrestling and diving. I want to see football. Other teams gave me this pleasure. Many did not.
 
Accepting defeat is sometimes hard, I know, but keeping suffering is not good to your health :roll:
Life goes on, take it easy.
We didn't headbutt anyone nor did we bribe the referee. We won the World Cup, period.
 
Ollie Garchy said:
1. We will never know. You sound like Italy (scoring in the last minute of overtime and then again with all Germans storming for a hail mary) totally overplayed Germany. That is the attitude that irks me. Italy's game against France was also not a given. France, while I did not like the team, outplayed Italy for most of the match. The Zidane affair killed their chances by demoralizing the entire squad. And, in any case, one penalty missing by two cm hardly indicates Italian superiority. No game was a given. All opponents had opportunities. Fortune smiled at times. At other times it did not.
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Weeelll, the fact is, Italy won. I agree. France outplayed them, but due to unfortunate circumstances...They didnt get it. Ill tell you like my dad tells me...Fortune and luck are when opportunity meets preparation. France was prepared 4 times, and Italy was prepared 6 times.

Ollie Garchy said:
2. Point finished.

3. I never glorified Zidane...never liked him or the French style.
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Do you agree with the punishment? Oh wait, there wasn't one.

Ollie Garchy said:
4. I listed three examples. Should I have listed 32? As far as "everyone diving" is concerned...that is an easy thing to say. It is certainly not true, however. One team diving once or twice is not the same as another team diving 50 times in one game. This issue is about frequency. Italian players, by the way, dive all over the pitch and not just near the goal. Watch the games very carefully. You will see what I mean. They dive as much to disrupt play as to gain a concrete advantage. It is a tactic...and it is a horrible one in my book. If you like it, ok. Then this point is finished too.
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My point is, they don't have to have these things to be considered good. Brazilians talent was nonexistent save Ronaldo. The Great Ronaldinho was no where near the hype.

Diving. Everyone dives. I can show you countless games where men dive because they are tired. 50 times in a game...Exaggerated, but I see your point.Cmon man. Everyone dives. Thats all I can say. The Italians are no different than anyone else. I dont like it at all, but as long as everyone does it, there is no way you or I can say "Those Italians are horrible divers, they are dirty." Ya know what? The Germans dive too. So do the Americans. And the French. And EVERY SINGLE TEAM IN THE WORLD CUP.

Ollie Garchy said:
Last point: Portugal was an insider's tip. They did make it to the EC final. They were a favourite and have been for years. No "overwhelming odds" here. I honestly picked Argentina or England as favourites. Why not Italy? I cannot stand their football style. Never will. I was hoping throughout that they would get wacked...Australia almost did it...but typical Italian cheating changed that outcome. COME ON, dude, do you really like a team that wins by bleeding the opponent or by diving. If you do, why not watch the Olympics...boxing, wrestling and diving. I want to see football. Other teams gave me this pleasure. Many did not.
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Mk...Portugal vs. Brazil. Who would you pick? Italian cheating...SORE LOSER. Just like IG said. Just because Germany didnt win it doesnt mean you have to call a nation cheaters.
 
C/1Lt Henderson said:
Mk...Portugal vs. Brazil. Who would you pick? Italian cheating...SORE LOSER. Just like IG said. Just because Germany didnt win it doesnt mean you have to call a nation cheaters.
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I love talking football, but let's stop the discussion on Italy. You like them. I cannot stand them. I would have been willing to overlook my disgust, however. If Italians had only said something like the following, I never would have been royally pissed: "we won the World Cup. We played many good teams. Our hard work paid off. And, fortune helped us on the way". But no. The Italians have to start patting themselves on the back and start ranting about how they deserved to win every game because of their superior abilities. From their perspective, every game was a given and that is just crap. I am not a sore loser. Italians were sore winners. [Look, I originally thought Germany would only make it to the quarters...they surpassed my expectations.]

An example from my perspective. Germany played a great game against Argentina. Germany won. I still recognize that Argentina was unfortunate and acknowledge the skills of the South Americans. I love their tough football and excellent teamwork. Overtime and penalties always reduce a game to luck...even if the Germans have only lost penalties on one occasion. This was the attitude of the German press. [If this is a cultural problem, ie. Northern European understatement against Southern European exaggeration, then we have an answer.]

Brazil vs. Portugal? Tough call. Based on Brazil's poor showing, I would have to say Portugal. But Brazil will return to the style of football that makes for great viewing...and many victories. Portugal, in my opinion, is on the out. Unlike Brazil, they don't seem to have millions of highly skilled young players to flesh out a new team. Ronaldo, while a diver, is an example of what Portugal could become provided a large enough reinforcement base. I am just unfamiliar with the current state of Portugal's youth program.

Look, I watched all the games at a PORTUGUESE bar here in Berlin -- a bar that had to change owners, unfortunately. Spanish fans and Italians came as well, not to mention some English fans and others. The only people who pissed me off were the Italians. They rubbed in every victory and stated right from the start that they were by far the best team. The Portuguese were nervous, hopeful, and always polite. So were the Spanish. Everyone...except for the Italians. Must be a cultural thing.

http://www.aventura-berlin.de/
 
But would you not have done the same thing if you or any other country had just beaten 31 other of the best teams in the world??

The Italians were right weren't they? They did have the best team. I don't know about by far, but they won...
 
Dude, that was well before the final...as in the first round. My "agro" really got going after the Austrialia game, but the US game did it for me prior to that. The Aussies had my sympathy. So did the bleeding Americans.
 
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Yea. I must admit, the Austrailian game was a big thing. But that isnt all the Italian dive...That is the officials part too. If the officials in this World Cup had been half way competent, he would have recognized the dive and not called it. The American foul was as blatant as the headbutt...But its like I said, the Italians were just having some fun and pride.I do the same thing with American Football...When the Falcons season starts, Im saying things like,"We're headin to the Super Bowl this year." and "Aint nobody good enough to stop the Falcons this year." among other things. Its all in sport...And when we beat a rival team, we gloat. Just as they do with us when they beat us. All in good fun, mate.
 
C/1Lt Henderson said:
Yea. I must admit, the Austrailian game was a big thing. But that isnt all the Italian dive...That is the officials part too. If the officials in this World Cup had been half way competent, he would have recognized the dive and not called it. The American foul was as blatant as the headbutt...But its like I said, the Italians were just having some fun and pride.I do the same thing with American Football...When the Falcons season starts, Im saying things like,"We're headin to the Super Bowl this year." and "Aint nobody good enough to stop the Falcons this year." among other things. Its all in sport...And when we beat a rival team, we gloat. Just as they do with us when they beat us. All in good fun, mate.
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I can accept that point of view about the Italian fans and FIFA officials. Damn, the officials made quite a few blunders...although we might be noticing this problem only because the camera work keeps getting better and better.

1. WC 2010 might be in the United States...or even Germany. The South
Africans are way behind in planning...not just building. FIFA is already looking for alternative countries who are able to host the cup.

2. Have you seen the new ranking by FIFA? Personally, I dislike the system for only one reason: wc hosts do not play any qualification matches, lose points, and therefore fall down the list. A WC game counts as 4 points and a friendly as 1...or is it a factor...whatever. Since only the last four years count, Germany's rank is a little low if we consider that Germany reached WC final in 2002, bombed out of the EC, but was third in 2006. I find Portugal a little low, too...considering two WC performances and the EC. Why is England fifth...ie. higher than Portugal? Strange. And, is Brazil just glued to the number one position?
 
Maybe the physicists who make these rankings use quantem mechanics that to us laymen would resemble nothing more than scratches on a board when in reality they hold the keys to the universe, and FIFA rankings.
 
Call me nuts, but I don't think the US deserves to be ranked in the top 16. Tell me, what is the name of the round following group play? Round of 16. The 16 best nations in the world, they did their part and every nation that is there had to work hard to get there. (Although I still say Onyewu was penalized simply for being a foot taller than the other player.) The teams in the Round of 16 should be the 16 top ranked teams in the world, plain and simple. As for Brazil, look at it this way, in the history of the WC they have proven themselves to be the best country in the world. They have the most WC titles and one loss doesn't mean they should have to drop from the top spot. Look at Tiger Woods, he stayed at the top of the world golfing rankings for almost a complete year despite Mickleson and Singh getting more wins during that time period, why? Because Woods was consistant. Just because he wasn't racking up the wins like he used to doesn't mean he is suddently terrible. He has won the most money over the last decade and he leads the world in top 10's, top 5's and top 3's over the same period. You don't have to always win to be the best, you just need to constantly keep yourself in contention so that when the opportunity arises you can grab it.
 
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