Could USA defeat USSR before the WW2 begun??

godofthunder9010 said:
All new buildup was focussed almost 100% on the Pacific with very little concern for the Atlantic. I think you're right about a good chunk of the Atlantic Fleet being moved, but I haven't any details.
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I believe it was the Pacific Fleet that was being downsized to send ships to the Atlantic Fleet to fight the German Wolfpacks. The most notable was whent he US gave 50 destroyers to GB in return for several Bases in Britian and their colonies, but that was I believe in 1940, so perhaps it was the opposite in 1939, but Japan was not thought of as an enemy at the time, at least not near so much as Germany, everyone thought that it would be the Germans who would attack and bring America into the war, not Japan, who was over 7,000 miles away.
 
Well if that is the actual case than the Americans may have had a problem, however it took american ships alot les time to get to Alaska than it did Russian onces in the end.
 
Damien435 said:
godofthunder9010 said:
All new buildup was focussed almost 100% on the Pacific with very little concern for the Atlantic. I think you're right about a good chunk of the Atlantic Fleet being moved, but I haven't any details.
Click to expand...

I believe it was the Pacific Fleet that was being downsized to send ships to the Atlantic Fleet to fight the German Wolfpacks. The most notable was whent he US gave 50 destroyers to GB in return for several Bases in Britian and their colonies, but that was I believe in 1940, so perhaps it was the opposite in 1939, but Japan was not thought of as an enemy at the time, at least not near so much as Germany, everyone thought that it would be the Germans who would attack and bring America into the war, not Japan, who was over 7,000 miles away.
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Japan had be a possible threat for a long long time and the USA had planned accordingly. FDR and people in the US Government knew that Germany was the greater danger, but they had a bit of a problem. As of 1940, the USA was more composed of German ancestry than anything else. Germans in the USA were not in favor of the idea of marking Nazi Germany as their #1 enemy. It took a long list of events to change that.

America was cautious of Japan, clueless about them culturally, and pretty racist in general.
 
Still when you get down to it the Americans could have always moved the forces if Russia possed them any threat via the Panama Canal.
 
True. The Russian strategy for invading Alaska: Get as much as you can across the Bering Strait before the USA can arrive and stop you. Also, make certain that they don't see it coming if at all possible. Surprise and speed would have been everything.
 
The Russians biggest problems would have been if America had patrolled those waters at that time....I think they would have though since there is ice up thier.
 
It is huge but almost no one lives thier, even today it has a poulation of like 400,000 image it in 1939
 
The USA intentially did not build decent highways and roads throughout Alaska for one very important reason -- if Japan invaded there, they'd have a very difficult time going from there to the Continental USA. This is one of the reasons most of Alaska is accessible only via airplane. The nation in question would be different, but the strategy would work essentially the same way. Moving through Alaska would be slow until they could connect to highways and railways, and if cutoff by the Pacific Fleet, keeping a large force fed and supplied would have been problematic. They'd still probably make it to Continental USA and get there before the USA has sufficient forces to repel them.

Its all dependent upon whether they can get a big enough force across before the Pacific Fleet stops them.
 
Thats true.


It also depends of the Russians can keep enough supplies coming in to them.


The Pacific fleet could come through Panama though and pay the Russian fleet a visit however that would take a while to get them thier.
 
The USSR could not have been defeated by the USA in the 1939 time period. No matter the naval power of the US, one must remember that wars are won on land and not out at sea. So, USA would have had to get into the Soviet mainland. If this daunting task was even accomplished, you must remember the only plausible point of attack is through the 55 mile Bering Strait and that the Soviets have an automatic advantage in knowing the terrain and being naturally proficient at winter warfare (due to previous hunting and living experience). Also any of the US Air Force's capabilities would be ruined. Planes of 1939 weren't prone to flying all the way to the industrial centers near the Urals, or the heart land of Moscow and it's suburbs. Also the landing zone near the Bering strait is in a geographic location that could possible the best natural defense system possible. Tundra stretching for miles, sunlight or darkness 24/7 (depending on season), and the area is a large natural spine that reaches form the Arctic ocean to Mongolia with peaks greater than 10000 feet. The USA would have to have an unbelievably well trained and massive force to even be able survive in that harsh environment. That is without even thinking about the Millions upon Millions of men that was the Soviet Army. Also Russia is well known for having the best and fiercest partisan forces in history. Honestly there is no way possible for the US land forces to attain anything but defeat in Russia in 1939. On the other hand, the USSR could possibly attain victory. First off, find me a valid source that states that the Russian Navy circa 1939 is as terrible as everyone here makes it out to be because I see otherwise( compare the number of ships pre 1939 in http://www.innvista.com/society/government/wwii/shipruss.htm and http://www.innvista.com/society/government/wwii/shipusa.htm ). Its not like the Soviets had rafts against nuclear submarines. After the fact that the Russian navy could hold off the American forces that would be pitted against them for a period of time long enough to establish a beachhead. One must presume the fact that the Russians would attack Alaska with forces that are naturally stationed in Siberia due to their natural disposition to the environment. Also its not like Alaska is heavily defended anyway. Once a suitable beachhead and operations bases are established the Soviets would only have to travel along the Canadian coastline down to Washington state. The Russian land forces would overwhelm any resistance and the Americans would not have any Partisan capabilities due to the fact that they have never previously been exerted.

Another thing has just sprung to mind. It takes 9 hours per ship to cross the canal, which means that the transportation of an entire fleet from the Atlantic Theater to the Pacific Theater is going to take one hell of a long time. The minimum depth of the canal is also 41 feet and that isn't a whole lot. What most have failed to realize is that the U.S. Navy is known for its power due to the production of ships after and during 1939 and not the ships that were commissioned before 1939 when this war would be taking place.
 
But the Russians would have to take Alaska and either transport ships over Alaska or go through Canada to get to the USA mainland wich would be a major problem in itself.

However yeah the US would have a hard time attacking Russia too.
 
The USA didn't have much of a military in 1939. Regardless of the damage Stalin Purge did to his military, the USA did not have a big enough military handle invading the USSR. The USSR probably didn't have a strong enough navy to decently support an invasion across the Bering Strait. The two countries would have had an awful time ever managing to pursue such a war.

I'm not quite clear on why anybody mentioned moving the Pacific Fleet through the Panama Canal. The Pacific Fleet was located in the right ocean and wouldn't require being moved anywhere at all. The Atlantic Ocean would not have been an option -- the UK would have stopped all hostilities via the Atlantic in pretty short order, mostly to ensure their own national security. The Royal Navy was too strong for either the USA or the USSR to try forcing the issue, not to mention all the other obstacles in the way.
 
Yeah the UK would be busy with the Germans, and if you get down to it the Soviets would be busy with Hitler and Poland at that time.
 
Well, I'd have to disagree since the proposed conflict is supposed to occur before WW2. Japan and Germany wouldn't be fighting the USSR because the proposed conflict starts and finishes before WW2 (ie before war between the USSR vs Germany + Japan begins).

Still, it brings us back to one of the major reason that this hypothetical conflict was so incredibly unlikely. The USSR had more important threats and other things happening directly on their borders. They'd never have bothered trying to launch a risky invasion across the Bering Strait. The USA was determinedly Isolationist in its foreign policy. If it didn't involve their mini Empire, they wouldn't have cared.
 
Yeah Russia would be busy with things going on in Europe and would be moving thier army to the west preparing for stuff over thier.
 
US could have won against the USSR before WW2 because the Red Army was severly depleted, and had primitive technology. Also when America's in a major war almost all our industrial capacity can be converted for war purposes. Also we had a bunch of people them who thought war would be fun and exciting. Which means our army would of had motivation while the Soviets would mainly be poor unfortunate conscripts. Though Assuming WW2 happened afterward, Well let's say you and my wouldn't be having this conversation.
 
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