bayonet improvement idea

senojekips said:
Shotguns are not "specifically" banned, however they do contravene the convention when used against personnel, in that: The Hague Convention of 1899 (and subsequently the International Humanitarian Law (drawn up at the Geneva Convention) in 1949 ratified by the USA on 2 Aug. 1955 ) forbade the use of expanding, deformable bullets in wartime, this specifically states that small arms ammunition will be of a metal jacketed type so as not to cause unnecessary suffering.

United States along with many other countries became signatories on 12 Aug 1949 http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/WebSign?ReadForm&id=375&ps=P and subsequently introduced a "Declaration of Reservation" in 1957 http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/NORM/D6B53F5B5D14F35AC1256402003F9920?OpenDocumentto allow such things as the death penalty.

Nowhere has the USA reserved the right too use shotguns as a weapon of war.
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interesting, "trenchguns" as they used to be called eh:drunkb:
 
The Hague Convention of 1899 wasn't that specific, wich again opened up for the use of poison, gas, trenchguns, and different other horrible weapons during WW I.
Since WW I was the war to end all wars, nobody saw the need for a new convention before WW II broke out.

The Geneva Convention did a lot to put that thing straight, but alas, in some parts of the world it's just an unread pice of paper.. :confused:

A little off-topic, but Norwegian patrol vehicles in Kosovo used to be equiped with at least one pump-action shotgun, but that was merely for disposal of stray dogs on the consern of rabies.
 
84RFK said:
The Hague Convention of 1899 wasn't that specific, wich again opened up for the use of poison, gas, trenchguns, and different other horrible weapons during WW I.
Since WW I was the war to end all wars, nobody saw the need for a new convention before WW II broke out.

The Geneva Convention did a lot to put that thing straight, but alas, in some parts of the world it's just an unread pice of paper.. :confused:

A little off-topic, but Norwegian patrol vehicles in Kosovo used to be equiped with at least one pump-action shotgun, but that was merely for disposal of stray dogs on the consern of rabies.
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ah, understandable, they didn't think it was necessary.
 
I find it ironic that FMJ rounds that go right through and leave you alive and suffering are considered more humane than expanding bullets that kill quickly.
 
major liability said:
I find it ironic that FMJ rounds that go right through and leave you alive and suffering are considered more humane than expanding bullets that kill quickly.
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Eh, well...

As a matter of fact it's not so that ALL bullets of the FMJ type does that.
There are several types, specially designed or unintentionally made unstabile, that starts spinning like a propeller after entering soft tissue, and you can imagine what a hole (and cavity) they can create... :-|

Besides, even the FMJ's that goes straight through the body does in most cases hit some bones inside the body, and they make up for excellent shrapnell too..
 
Getting back on track, shotguns are not banned per se, however, if used against personnel, they do contravene the word and intent of the International Humanitarian Law (Geneva Convention).

It may seem unrealistic but "them's the breaks".
 
84RFK said:
And for those of you who think the knife is obsolete, remember the Gurkha's!

Story goes that during the Falkland war a company of Argentine soldiers took off and ran for their life when their field chaplain told them that they were facing the Gurkhas, and that they used to cut the heads of their enemy with their curved "Kukri" knifes...

Truth or not, personally I wouldn't stay around to face a Gurkha in close combat.
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They had also heard that The Gurkhas would eat them.
 
senojekips said:
Getting back on track, shotguns are not banned per se, however, if used against personnel, they do contravene the word and intent of the International Humanitarian Law (Geneva Convention).

It may seem unrealistic but "them's the breaks".
Click to expand...

Ok, but what about flamethrowers and incindeiary weapons?
 
senojekips said:
Shotguns are not "specifically" banned, however they do contravene the convention when used against personnel, in that: The Hague Convention of 1899 (and subsequently the International Humanitarian Law (drawn up at the Geneva Convention) in 1949 ratified by the USA on 2 Aug. 1955 ) forbade the use of expanding, deformable bullets in wartime, this specifically states that small arms ammunition will be of a metal jacketed type so as not to cause unnecessary suffering.

United States along with many other countries became signatories on 12 Aug 1949 http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/WebSign?ReadForm&id=375&ps=P and subsequently introduced a "Declaration of Reservation" in 1957 http://www.icrc.org/ihl.nsf/NORM/D6B53F5B5D14F35AC1256402003F9920?OpenDocumentto allow such things as the death penalty.

Nowhere has the USA reserved the right too use shotguns as a weapon of war.
Click to expand...

Issue buck shot is copper jacketed. Which makes it a multi-projectile round. Copper Jacketed 00 buck is like shooting an individual 6 times with a .32 caliber FMJ round. Doesn't deform or expand. Now was 00 lead buck being used. It would violate.
 
Yes, O3USMC in that case their use against personnel would be allowable the way I read it.

Other than that, the whole point is moot anyway, there are many worse ways of dying in time of war than being hit with a load of 00. Just as a point of interest, in Australia 00 shells have 9 x .32" pellets in a 1 1/4 oz load, your 00 shot must be larger in diameter?
 
senojekips said:
Yes, O3USMC in that case their use against personnel would be allowable the way I read it.

Other than that, the whole point is moot anyway, there are many worse ways of dying in time of war than being hit with a load of 00. Just as a point of interest, in Australia 00 shells have 9 x .32" pellets in a 1 1/4 oz load, your 00 shot must be larger in diameter?
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No we have 9 shot too. That was actually me thick fingering the key board.:sorry:
 
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